State of the forum - Oct/Nov 2022 (Suggested reading for all members)

[TicTokCroc]

It is the best thread on the forum.

Not surprising people want to participate.

I don't think much Is going to change. This is like a shot over the bow. People are going to tip toe around for a while, maybe post more fishing content to bolster their street cred. Lots of likes will fly here followed by the projection of innocence. Then the same people will post the same stuff, it will be OK because the discussions are civil. What I'm curious and we will wait to see is what is considered crossing the line.

 

[longputt]

But that's simply not the kind of site that Billy, Evan, and I want to spend our free time running. And if PNWFF fails because we didn't feel like having political shitposts, the three of us are completely fine with that.

Unfortunately, even though there is 12 month fly fishing in WA/OR we have reached the doldrums, where a lot fewer folks are fishing and probably distracted by the news and advertising for an election. Winter fly fishing is not for everyone.

I think a little more moderation will be required this time of the year. Don't feel bad for locking threads, I cannot think of one time I thought a thread was shut down too soon, in fact just the opposite you have more restraint than I do! Don't over think it, if you don't like it stop it, it's your site!

I know you'd like an unmoderated site, but maybe you could give a few volunteers the ability to lock threads this time of the year and minimize your time?

 

[Evan B]

Unfortunately, even though there is 12 month fly fishing in WA/OR we have reached the doldrums, where a lot fewer folks are fishing and probably distracted by the news and advertising for an election. Winter fly fishing is not for everyone.

I think a little more moderation will be required this time of the year. Don't feel bad for locking threads, I cannot think of one time I thought a thread was shut down too soon, in fact just the opposite you have more restraint than I do! Don't over think it, if you don't like it stop it, it's your site!

I know you'd like an unmoderated site, but maybe you could give a few volunteers the ability to lock threads this time of the year and minimize your time?

WE totally recognize that and acknowledge it, which is why we're still taking a pretty light approach overall. We don't moderate this even close to as heavily as the old site, and have let a lot of things go on that would have been shut down in the old days.

It's also not just the work involved, it's that we legitimately have folks who get tired of seeing these threads and move on because they don't want to be a part of it. It's not a lot of people, but it's enough. Whether they leave because they don't like that content, or because they get attacked, or they don't like how us as admins handle the mess. It's a lose/lose/lose situation for the amusement of a very small number of people. We have more to lose than gain by having some types of content, and we're just asking to get it under control.

 

[Evan B]

Another concise version:

We want this to be a place where people from all walks of life can come together and see that maybe the world isn't as ugly as we're all being told. A few folks from different "tribes" can have a common bond and be friends despite constantly being bombarded with media that tells us otherwise. That's our goal here, and what we're going to keep our vibe aiming at.

 

[Snopro]

It is the best thread on the forum.

What's "best" is subjective and I think a reflection of the beholder. Personally I think the best thread is, "what's catching you fish".

 

[swimmy]

I know you'd like an unmoderated site, but maybe you could give a few volunteers the ability to lock threads this time of the year and minimize your time?

I'll start working on a team

 

[Evan B]

Fly fishing forums by nature are boring. So is it really surprising which threads get the most action here?

1 - The fishing reports and content you posted were anything but boring. That is some legitimately good shit and among us mods' favorite posts.

2 - We've discussed a hidden forum that's opt-in, opt-out to maybe quarantine certain things. But it's still in discussion because we're just not sure there's anything to gain from it considering the entire rest of the internet is already doing the exact same thing. I can't think of much of any major social media that doesn't already scratch that itch.

 

[Buzzy]

#itsnotabobber
#noswivels

Just messing

Love you guys!

#bobbersrus

Seriously - I have a lifetime supply of Iracators (each with its peg drilled out).

 

[Matt Paluch]

I will do my best, and I apologize for my part in a recent thread that turned sour. I work in the political arena, and the things that don't seem like a big deal to me are probably a bit more distressing to others. I'll try to keep that in mind moving forward.

 

[HauntedByWaters]

It must be too cold to fish and too early to ski for the inlanders?

 

[dep]

Mods: late to the show, but thanks for posting this. love this place.

 

[swimmy]

You are missing the point.

Nah man, I get the point. Just sharing another perspective.

1 - The fishing reports and content you posted were anything but boring. That is some legitimately good shit and among us mods' favorite posts.

2 - We've discussed a hidden forum that's opt-in, opt-out to maybe quarantine certain things. But it's still in discussion because we're just not sure there's anything to gain from it considering the entire rest of the internet is already doing the exact same thing. I can't think of much of any major social media that doesn't already scratch that itch.

1. Thanks. Dime is stealing the show right now.

2. One more rule, @Salmo_g has to keep his posts to 8 paragraphs or less

 

[Salmo_g]

what is considered crossing the line.

Trolling or baiting other forum members into a useless argument can be less black and white. But the simple example of crossing the line is when you attack a person instead of attacking their argument. For example, "I voted for X, and you voted for Y. Since you disagree with me, you're an idiot!" That is invariably considered crossing the line. I can avoid crossing that line by engaging civilly with you (albeit probably more boring) by addressing you that, "You voted for Y, but Y plans to implement policies a, b, and c. Those policies are deleterious to many people because they cause effects q, p, and r." No lines crossed, and we remain in disagreement, but just maybe we have a better understanding of why we disagree. I think that's called disagreeing without being disagreeable.

 

[Evan B]

Trolling or baiting other forum members into a useless argument can be less black and white. But the simple example of crossing the line is when you attack a person instead of attacking their argument. For example, "I voted for X, and you voted for Y. Since you disagree with me, you're an idiot!" That is invariably considered crossing the line. I can avoid crossing that line by engaging civilly with you (albeit probably more boring) by addressing you that, "You voted for Y, but Y plans to implement policies a, b, and c. Those policies are deleterious to many people because they cause effects q, p, and r." No lines crossed, and we remain in disagreement, but just maybe we have a better understanding of why we disagree. I think that's called disagreeing without being disagreeable.

Also known as civil discourse. An unfortunately forgotten art in the last couple decades.

 

[swimmy]

But the simple example of crossing the line is when you attack a person instead of attacking their argument.

I don't really see that happening here, even in the most heated debates. Sure there is a some dunking but flat out attacking other members?

Maybe I'm missing it.

 

[TicTokCroc]

Trolling or baiting other forum members into a useless argument can be less black and white. But the simple example of crossing the line is when you attack a person instead of attacking their argument. For example, "I voted for X, and you voted for Y. Since you disagree with me, you're an idiot!" That is invariably considered crossing the line. I can avoid crossing that line by engaging civilly with you (albeit probably more boring) by addressing you that, "You voted for Y, but Y plans to implement policies a, b, and c. Those policies are deleterious to many people because they cause effects q, p, and r." No lines crossed, and we remain in disagreement, but just maybe we have a better understanding of why we disagree. I think that's called disagreeing without being disagreeable.

It's is pretty black and white, I think you might be taking my concerns a bit too literally. I dont need an explanation of what is what. I don't start controversial threads, I don't insult people or attack them personally. Trolled, yea I've done some trolling but all in good intentions(my opinion) to either make a joke to lighten the mood or to help make a point, so have a lot of people here. If anyone wants to waste their time they can look back at my content.

 

[Salmo_g]

I don't really see that happening here, even in the most heated debates. Sure there is a some dunking but flat out attacking other members?

Maybe I'm missing it.

You're not entirely wrong, but there is a fair amount of oblique ways of attacking arguments that appear to be more about attacking someone than really getting into the nuts and bolts of what you find wrong with their argument. You have been a classic example of that with your numerous remarks along the lines of ". . . that's what you get when woke progressives vote for X." Or if someone makes a remark critical of Trump, you would respond with, ". . . what about the Russia hoax?" - known as whataboutism, deflecting to a different topic instead of expending the effort to make your argument about what was inaccurate or otherwise wrong with the critical remark about Trump. But you seem to like baiting to provoke reactionary remarks because you enjoy mixing it up with those you disagree with. And that's a fun sport of its own, but it also looks to be exactly the sort of sport or exchange that our site owners object to and don't want on this forum. Their house, their rules. You're smart. I don't think you miss much. And this post is less than 8 paragraphs.

 

[Salmo_g]

It's is pretty black and white, I think you might be taking my concerns a bit too literally. I dont need an explanation of what is what. I don't start controversial threads, I don't insult people or attack them personally. Trolled, yea I've done some trolling but all in good intentions(my opinion) to either make a joke to lighten the mood or to help make a point, so have a lot of people here. If anyone wants to waste their time they can look back at my content.

Trolling or baiting is, or at least can be, more nuanced. I think that is what makes it so much more work for our site owners. I guess a useful check and balance can be, "If I'm making more work for the site owners, I'm doing this wrong."

 

[TicTokCroc]

I don't really see that happening here, even in the most heated debates. Sure there is a some dunking but flat out attacking other members?

Maybe I'm missing it.

This is what I have been failing to articulate.
So the next global warming thread pops up and I put in a contrasting view point. Or a joke to lighten the mood. So who's trolling who? Do different views get to be expressed if they arn't popular? Or am I the troll because 5 people that disagree reported it. I'm not insulting or attacking anyone.

 

[TicTokCroc]

Don't get me wrong it's not my intention to just post in controversial threads, I enjoy all the content here. It just irritates me when a good Ole boys club forms that gets to talk about whatever they want, and any disagreement = trolling.