I thought references were only needed for job interviews
Shops newsletters, reports and... hotspotting?
- Thread starter mcswny
- Start date
Dustin Chromers
Legend
With the advent of the internet "Figure It Out Yourself" went down the toilet long ago and will only get worse.
Sadly, it's much easier to prostitute our fisheries for personal gain than working a real job.
Even people not selling something can't resist the street cred of internet status. It's dumb. Kill what you say you love in the quest for internet hand jobs. Some even wear this as a cape and insist they are helping people. Let's be honest. It's all for an ego boost or money.
Dustin Chromers
Legend
Gates are good. They limit access to a finite resource. It's not gate keeping to not blow up a fishery. It's prudent and makes people put in the work. It's a shortcut the other way.
Most of my working life has been either in a fly shop or guiding. There's a pretty big difference between sharing the well known productive waters and the places that are incredible if only fished 20-100 times a year (total days for each angler). The sad part about these places getting posted to internet or email reports is that they don't even generate enough business to justify ruining them for the shop owners who only care about making money - so the spots are ruined for no reason at all. The shop might get a bump in email subscriptions, but those die off as soon as people learn about the "secret" waters. I'd frame it that way for the owners.
That’s exactly how I framed my email. I feel like I had a very diplomatic, non-agressive tone. I’ve yet to receive a response. Granted it’s only been 24 hours
I guess I don't have a dog in this mcswny war and I don't know what shop it is that's doing this so I can't join in the STFU crusade. I'd be pissed off if this shop were disclosing "blue lines" in my area. They're already known, they get fished; my fav is a small creek that just won't take a lot of pressure. I wish you well in your efforts!That’s exactly how I framed my email. I feel like I had a very diplomatic, non-agressive tone. I’ve yet to receive a response. Granted it’s only been 24 hours
DerekWhipple
Steelhead
Weren't most of these names already dropped on the original WestFly or WFF? 
Weren't most of these names already dropped on the original WestFly or WFF?
Hey man..... don't spoil a good group rant. Self pity party's are once again the new thing.
Does it matter?Weren't most of these names already dropped on the original WestFly or WFF?
Doesn't a self pity party equate to non-action? I'm not just old man complaining to the clouds, I'm also trying to start a dialogue with the shop as well.Hey man..... don't spoil a good group rant. Self pity party's are once again the new thing.
Anything and everything you say in the company of fly fishers (or old men - including myself) will be challenged or at least used to give grief.
Totally understand and agree.
I will also say, it's more in how you say it. This thread has lasted 3 pages, with people challenging and no one has gotten up in arms (including my self), because I feel I've (and everyone else) kept a pretty respectful tone.
When a fly shop posted a report on one of my favorite places that doesn’t see much pressure, I talked with them in person and they agreed that they messed up. Not saying it would work in other situations but a face to face conversation often works better than an email. Apologies if this was already discussed in the last three pages of this thread.
I totally agree. With that being said, I’m not the best in social and confrontational situations (working on that in therapy), and I truly feel I was able to present my best self (and case) via email. If I get no response, I may email again.
I had a guy blast out the name of a creek that used to be a very tightly guarded secret just because I mentioned that he technically needed a BLM permit to guide there. I even said that the BLM wasn't enforcing that rule and that nobody else who guided there had the permit either. Dude came unhinged - but he was fairly well known for coming unhinged.
@Evan B , @Josh , @Billy , please deleted this post as warranted...
I really think it is about a generational thingy...
Old timers worked hard for and respected/cherished what they had accomplished. When one works for something they appreciated it a lot more. Part of the reason why the 'middle class' was established and grew. They also did not share everything that made their success....
Later generations assumed the 'golden platter'. They lost respect for hard work and making things happen by finding/earning ways to make it happen.
I can remember a job interview of a young recent college graduate. I asked him ' where do you expect to be in 5 years". He said "a VP". I explained to him in a large company (200k employees) like this it took me 10 years to get into management. His response was " obviously you are not good".
Life is much more transparent and visible nowadays. Privacy has gone by the wayside. What happens now is very transactional.
No wonder why our special streams or hot spots are no longer. It is not about legacy, maintaining special places, or for the future generation(s). It is all about what can I get out of it now...
I prefer the times of OMJ and his rules...
With the advent of AI, tracking of every website I ever visited, and complete visibility/transparency of our travels, will there be anything no longer private? Scary!
I really think it is about a generational thingy...
Old timers worked hard for and respected/cherished what they had accomplished. When one works for something they appreciated it a lot more. Part of the reason why the 'middle class' was established and grew. They also did not share everything that made their success....
Later generations assumed the 'golden platter'. They lost respect for hard work and making things happen by finding/earning ways to make it happen.
I can remember a job interview of a young recent college graduate. I asked him ' where do you expect to be in 5 years". He said "a VP". I explained to him in a large company (200k employees) like this it took me 10 years to get into management. His response was " obviously you are not good".
Life is much more transparent and visible nowadays. Privacy has gone by the wayside. What happens now is very transactional.
No wonder why our special streams or hot spots are no longer. It is not about legacy, maintaining special places, or for the future generation(s). It is all about what can I get out of it now...
I prefer the times of OMJ and his rules...
With the advent of AI, tracking of every website I ever visited, and complete visibility/transparency of our travels, will there be anything no longer private? Scary!
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I don't think it's as generational as you think. This thread was started by a millennial who values what these fisheries are. In my time on the internet, I've seen a LOT of spot burning and spot requests from the older generations.
I think it just plain comes down to individuals. Before the internet, we had things like Fishing & Hunting News doing the spot burning legwork. I know I had some of my special spots blown up back in the 90s by them.
Difficulty in math - first sign of agingI'm 35
Edit: 36
I like and respect the way you have presented your case. Keep up the good fight.
cheers