2025 Tuna and Exotics

You all with your fancy knots. Everyone knows the only knot for line to line connections (fly lines to leader, braid to mono) when tuna fishing the….


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I proved this without question on my last tuna trips last year 🤣.
 
Matt B said:
I mean if you like to gamble, I suppose that’s perfectly fine…
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I got the look of disapproval from Nick after breaking one of those....far worse than getting yelled at.
 
Nick Clayton said:
Oh man, so many rabbit holes to dig into in this thread haha. I apologize that I keep diving into these things, as I'm not entirely sure my thoughts make total sense at time, but I'm stuck at home on a dreary day today so whatever lol

I have so many thoughts regarding the distance that my gear is being trolled behind the boat. Over the years I have experimented with this a ton, but I have settled on a basic approach that works well for me and I like to stick with that. Mostly because I'm a big believer in keeping things as simple as possible, and eliminating variables.

If I'm running a 5 line spread, I like to run a W type spread. By that I mean, I run two short lines off each corner. I don't run them by specific distance, rather a free spool count of seconds. So with the boat in gear at full troll speed, I free spool those two short lines for 8 seconds. This puts them roughly 25-30' behind the boat, right in the wash. The two side rods in outriggers I do at 14-18 seconds. I vary this count based on water conditions, but the variables would be very difficult to type out.
The last rod is run straight out the back, basically directly between the two short corner rods, and I run that one waaaaaaay back. Like 25 seconds, often more. We call this the "shotgun" rod, and I like my shotgun rod way, way behind the boat.

I've run this basic spread since I was a deckhand, and to toot my own horn, my troll game is strong.

There is a very common thought in the albacore world that keeping the gear close to the boat is crucial, and trolling with gear too far back is a disadvantage. The thought being that if you're trolling and you hook a fish too far away from the boat, then it's going to make it difficult to really get those fish up and fired up at the boat because they were so far away when you first hooked up. I've just never once seen that to be the case. When I worked on the commercial boat we referred to our shortest lines as our "money lines". Not because they hooked more fish, but simply because it was so much faster to hook/land/unhook/redeploy jig with the short line than the longer ones. But without fail, our two longest lines hooked the most fish. It wasn't even close.

I always remembered that and started experimenting with it when I started decking. The first few captains I worked for insisted on keeping the gear tight to the boat, but my second year when I went to work for Ian he gave me full freedom to do what I wanted, so I started playing around with it which lead to the spread I've settled on today. Just like on the commercial boat, our long line was our top producer. Not every day of course, but over the course of the season it was the clear winner. And I've found that to be the case every single season I've worked since then. Without fail, black and purple cedar ran a mile behind the boat will hook up.

In all the time I experimented with that, mostly just slowly dropping that shotgun line back further and further, I never once encountered a scenario where I felt that the distance was in any way an inhibiting factor for really getting a baitstop going. Those fish can see so well, and swim so damned fast, that even if you catch the edge of a school 150' from the boat, those fish can be keyed on a small brail of anchovies in a second or two. If they don't respond in that scenario, I believe there is a very good chance they weren't going to respond no matter what.

I always, always, always run at least one line way off the boat. I absolutely hate the thought of running everything short and tight and putting all my eggs in one basket. I've hooked a ton of fish trolling right behind the boat, there is no doubt that its worth running some gear tight. However, I have NEVER experienced a scenario where running tight was the ONLY way to get hookups. On the flip side, I have seen many days where short lines flat out wouldn't get bit for whatever reason, but the long lines would. So since I've never found running long to be a disadvantage, I've never seen a reason not to incorporate it.

For a long time now I've been of the belief that the short lines consistently being bit is a sign of aggressive fish. In theory, those short lines are the first lines any fish are likely to see, and they don't have much time to consider a response. Trolling at 5 or 6 knots there isn't a lot of time from when they look up, to when the next set of lures is going to be going over the top of them, so if they immediately respond and smash the short lines I've always taken that as a sign of fish that are likely to be aggressive. On the other side of that coin, I feel like the days where only the shotgun rod gets bit, or occasionally an outrigger line, are a sign of fish that are a bit more weary. Again just in theory, but I always picture those fish down there doing their thing when we go over. They immediately look up and see those short lines and they think, eh, whatever. Next they see the mid lines, and again they're like eh, looks good but whatever. Then a few seconds later they see that stupid cedar plug go by, wobbling along, and one of them just can't help themselves and they give in to temptation. So maybe they weren't super fired up to begin with, but by the end of the parade of offerings at least one of them just can't resist.

Now, this is just the way I like to look at it, and I am in no way claiming to know what the hell I'm talking about. I've seen wide open bait stops that were initially started by a cedar plug hookup 250' behind the boat, and I've seen quite a few instances where both short corner rods instantly snap off, and then we stop and convert to bait and don't touch/see/mark another fish. So it's definitely nothing set in stone, just how I like to look at it. I like to cover all my bases in regards to distance from the boat, and I really don't see any reason not to.

These same concepts definitely apply to fishing with fly rods, though some things are a bit more difficult to match up precisely. On most fly trips I've done we have had 4 rods on board, so we don't run a 5 rod spread. We also can't free spool a fly reel in the same manner so it's not quite as easy to set them to specific distances. I like to run a similar spread minus the long rod out the back. Two shorter lines out the corner, and two longer off the sides. I can't claim to have been able to notice a lot of patterns when it comes to distance on fly trips, mainly because I am not as involved with the setting of the spread so at any given time I don't always know where everything is at. On gear trips, even though I'm not actually setting the spread most of the time, the deckhand knows exactly where I want them so I always know where everything is even if I didn't do it myself.

One big difference to me between fly trips, and our standard gear trips, is that for the most part people are super stoked to hook fish with fly rods to the point that people often start to really notice little differences. On any given gear trip we do, there may be one hot troll rod for any particular reason. Maybe the starboard outrigger with the Seahawks clone is constantly getting bit one day, or the port corner short rod with the Mexican flag mini clone another day. On these days I never, ever, ever change things up. I may notice one line is getting bit more than another, but I always chalk it up to a variety of variables so long that it's note even worth considering. I prefer to play the averages. Over the course of the season I see swings here and there, but I am confident that over the course of time keeping with what I believe in will pay off. And it does. The problem that comes in to play is that on gear trips, troll fish just aren't really a big deal. By that I mean, we aren't looking to catch a bunch of fish trolling. Ideally we hook just one fish trolling, then stop the boat and load up on live bait. Most people know this, and most people prefer to catch them on live bait. To the point that sometimes it's difficult to get people to get on the rod with the troll fish, because they just want to go straight to bait. Trolling is simply an ends to a mean, so nobody really cares too much.

Fly trips on the other hand, are different. People are engaged. They're holding their rods. They're setting the distance of their line. They maniuplate the line or the rod tip, giving it twitches and such. Doing all sorts of things that may, or may not change the results. When the bite does happen, the rod is in hand. The grab is felt. The adrenaline spike is instant. It's all a much cooler experience for a lot of people. It becomes more OF an experience in itself, if that makes sense. The desire to hook a fish becomes higher. I feel like on gear trips everyone wants a rod to go off, because of what it might lead to. On fly trips, people want their rod to go off because that in itself is pretty friggen rad. Add in the challenge that catching these fish on cast flies often presents, and it puts a higher emphasis on hooking troll fish, specifically to the individual. So what I've seen out there in roughly a thousand albacore trips means absolutely nothing to the only person on the boat who hasn't hooked a troll fish that day, or the person who has only hooked a single fish while standing next to Guy who hooks six. So this puts me in a weird spot where my day to day focus is based on averages, keeping things simple, and big picture but then I find myself trying to explain to the one guy onboard who hasn't hooked a troll fish that he hasn't done anything wrong, and I wouldn't change anything up. I've had this very conversation with a good many of you, and it's something I'm trying to really open my mind to. When I tell someone that I truly don't believe things like fly color matter, and that I wouldn't change flies if it was me, I truly believe that. I don't say that out of ill will. I believe that to the depths of my soul. But again, thats based on my own experiences and while the math may make sense over the course of many seasons being out there every day, it doesn't always add up in the sense of that one person who isn't hooking fish that particular day. I'm really trying to focus on expanding my perspective on things, and seeing things from others perspective this year and trying to find ways to approach those scenarios better.

My god these tuna threads make me ramble lol
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Keep on rambling I love it! Just when I have a question in mind to ask in a reply, you and other members addressed them in the subsequent posts 🤣
 
clarkman said:
I got the look of disapproval from Nick after breaking one of those....far worse than getting yelled at.
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He demanded to see where I broke off and then laughed in my face….and it was totally deserved 😂. The trip before, I made the loud proclamation that I was using perfection loops and was sticking to them. Oops….
 
jasmillo said:
He demanded to see where I broke off and then laughed in my face….and it was totally deserved 😂. The trip before, I made the loud proclamation that I was using perfection loops and was sticking to them. Oops….
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God that was funny

One thing I appreciate about Jason is he has the best attitude every time he's on the water. I've seen him lose a fair number of fish at this point, and all he ever does is laugh and say something like "That was fun" and go after another. Love it. Some people get pretty upset, even angry, when losing fish. It can be stressful from my perspective.

I'll truly never really understand using a perfection loop, but unlike pickled eggs, I won't ban them from my boat. As long as the user doesn't get angry when it eventually breaks, have at it :)

My New Year's resolution this year is to not be so stuck in my ways, but I gotta draw the line somewhere I suppose. Pickled eggs and any sort of Xrap plugs are still not welcome on my boat.
 
Nick Clayton said:
God that was funny

One thing I appreciate about Jason is he has the best attitude every time he's on the water. I've seen him lose a fair number of fish at this point, and all he ever does is laugh and say something like "That was fun" and go after another. Love it. Some people get pretty upset, even angry, when losing fish. It can be stressful from my perspective.

I'll truly never really understand using a perfection loop, but unlike pickled eggs, I won't ban them from my boat. As long as the user doesn't get angry when it eventually breaks, have at it :)

My New Year's resolution this year is to not be so stuck in my ways, but I gotta draw the line somewhere I suppose. Pickled eggs and any sort of Xrap plugs are still not welcome on my boat.
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That’s because he’s not fishing Rio OBS, you should see him work out a tangle 🤣
 
jasmillo said:
He demanded to see where I broke off and then laughed in my face….and it was totally deserved 😂. The trip before, I made the loud proclamation that I was using perfection loops and was sticking to them. Oops….
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I needed a spare rod after my shitty Rio line broke on a fish (possible I stepped on it and damaged it, possible it was just Rio) and Jason kindly offered his spare rod.. but I literally didn't believe you at all when you said you had a perfection loop on your leader. I took me a bit to notice you weren't laughing, I was glad you warned me so I could cut it off. I was almost expecting you to next whip out a pack of Eagle Claw snelled bait holder hooks you bought at Kmart in 1988 and try and get me to tie one of those into my setup, because that is definitely perfection loop-adjacent fishing territory. I would believe almost anything about a man who fishes a perfection loop past their teenaged years, especially offshore.
 
And for the record, speaking of my early fishing career, if I had a dollar for every truck trout who gulped my worm draped eagle claw snelled bait holder hook bought at Kmart out of sight and directly down to their ass, I could buy a pretty sweet tuna fishing fly rod setup.
 
Tallguy said:
I needed a spare rod after my shitty Rio line broke on a fish (possible I stepped on it and damaged it, possible it was just Rio) and Jason kindly offered his spare rod.. but I literally didn't believe you at all when you said you had a perfection loop on your leader. I took me a bit to notice you weren't laughing, I was glad you warned me so I could cut it off. I was almost expecting you to next whip out a pack of Eagle Claw snelled bait holder hooks you bought at Kmart in 1988 and try and get me to tie one of those into my setup, because that is definitely perfection loop-adjacent fishing territory. I would believe almost anything about a man who fishes a perfection loop past their teenaged years, especially offshore.
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I did give you fair warning..ha. I think we’re on two trips together again this year. If I can find Eagle Claw pre-tied 2/0 bait holders with 30 lb mono I’m bringing you a special fly to use for one of those trips :).
 
Only counts using a yellow Eagle Claw spin outfit, fished with the reel above the rod. Preferably loaded with hi-viz blue mono. That is something for which I will stop fishing to take video.
 
SilverFly said:
Only counts using a yellow Eagle Claw spin outfit, fished with the reel above the rod. Preferably loaded with hi-viz blue mono. That is something for which I will stop fishing to take video.
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I owned that fishing rod, and there may be old pictures of me fishing it. Never with the reel above the rod though, I was taught well early on. Yellow glass with the red wraps.
 
I actually have tuna-capable heavy duty Eagle Claw fiberglass conventional rods. None of them have been on the water in years, but they're stashed in my shed. I did catch a few tunas on them when I first started running my own boat 6-7yrs ago.
 
I don’t think I ever had that rod myself. I definitely killed way too many small stream brookies for the table as a kid back east, fishing eagle claw pre-tied bait holders hooks and ultra light spinning gear. A pack of those hooks, maybe a small split shot and some leaves in the woods to dig under for worms were all that was needed to have a day of it. Man they were tasty but would not do it now. That said, I hear those little brooks still have a decent number of fish in them.
 
Growing up I typically had 3 rods. A trout rod, a steelhead rod, and a salmon rod. The concept of having specialty gear was quite foreign in my poor household. Anyway, my salmon rod for the bulk of my youth was a yellow Eagle Claw rod with a Penn....I dunno, 209 maybe. Caught an awful lot of fish on that setup.


I've caught, or seen albacore caught, with just about everything imaginable, but I'm not sure I can recall seeing one caught on an Eagle Claw.

Craziest thing I've seen someone try to catch albacore with is spears. Maybe 5 years ago one of the other six pack boats that used to work out of Westport took a group of guys out who wanted to try to spearfish for albacore. They never actually succeeded that day, but hearing the play by play over the radio from the captain was quite entertaining.
They trolled hook less gear, and when it went off they'd stop, throw bait, and jump in the water with their spear guns. The captain that day was Kerry Allen. Anyone who knows Kerry knows he's one those hilarious, larger than life type of dudes. His accounts of their day on the radio were incredible lol

It always cracks me up that in the regs it specifies that it is legal to shoot albacore with a bow and arrow. The fact that it specifically mentions that makes me think someone has to have tried it. That would be a pretty damned impressive shot! Years ago I was sitting at the crew house when Merry got a call from a group of 4 guys wanting to book a boat to go out and try to shoot ocean sunfish with a bow. She politely told him to get fucked. Gee, what a challenge...shooting a floating Volkswagen


jasmillo said:
Man they were tasty but would not do it now.
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I haven't eaten brookies a ton, but caught and ate them here and there as a kid. Been a long time but I sure remember those little bastards being tasty cooked over a campfire
 
Shot from my very first self-run tuna trip on a boat I quickly sold to get something more ocean-able. Notice that signature yellow Eagle Claw on board (with a level wind line counter reel...) This was before I had begun investing in real tuna gear.

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I had some sort of old Mitchell reel on mine, one of the 1970s era vintage oval shaped ones. My grandfather's before he handed it off. Next time I am back east I might go search for it in the fishing gear closet.
 
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