Parachute Hackle Discussion

[Long_Rod_Silvers]

Congo Hair

Having a few with foam posts can be nice for those times you're fishing a bit choppier water.

 

[mcswny]

Having a few with foam posts can be nice for those times you're fishing a bit choppier water.

Smart. I've never tied them with foam.

 

[RCF]

In my younger days I just tied the parachute by hand. Eyes and dexterity helped with that. Once I found the gallows it made it so much easier. Now with arthritis gallows is the only way to go...

 

[Long_Rod_Silvers]

What's everyone's though process for when to use split tailing fibers vs. single clump hackle fibers? For whatever reason I have so much more confidence in a parachute fly that has split tailing fibers vs. clumped hackle fibers. The comparadun comes to mind. Or something like this as an example of how I prefer the tail to look:

 

[tkww]

I guess that's why Adam's work so well?

That's been one of my thoughts. Though the med-gray dub often gets darker when wet--less so with the synthetics these days, but still.

What do people like to use as the parachute? Calf tail, poly yarn or?

Anything synthetic--poly, para-wing, congo, whatever. No need to clean/stack, easier to tie in and ties in more compactly, can be trimmed to size/shape after tying in, wider range of colors, can mix colors (hot spot/sighter), floats better, etc. I do love the look of a nice bright-white calf wing, but I just don't find myself doing it very often.

 

[mcswny]

What's everyone's though process for when to use split tailing fibers vs. single clump hackle fibers? For whatever reason I have so much more confidence in a parachute fly that has split tailing fibers vs. clumped hackle fibers. The comparadun comes to mind. Or something like this as an example of how I prefer the tail to look:

I try not to overthink it TOO much

I usually just use a clump of moose hair or CDL hackles if it a size 18 and smaller.

 

[clarkman]

Just wanted to hear everyone's thoughts on parachute hackle re: concave side up, or concave side down when wrapping on a parachute post.

When we buy hackle we are only really looking at one side of the feather. The underside of the feather that we don't see can be a very different color, or lack the intensity of the pattern (grizzly/barred, badger, speckled, etc.) That we see on the front side of the feather. Some colors/patterns are less pronounced on the underside of the feather than others, but in general, they are significantly different.

Here is an example I spun up today for reference. Color on this one isn't crazy different, but the pattern is pretty much non-existent on the underside of the feather. The color is grizzly dyed sunburst:
View attachment 52133

Concave up (fish sees front side of feather):
View attachment 52129
View attachment 52130

Concave down (fish sees underside of feather):
View attachment 52131
View attachment 52132

From a fishing standpoint, what do we want the fish to see? If it's the front side of the feather, does the concave side facing up affect the fishability of the fly?

In my eyes, the concave facing up puts the hackle further away from the waters surface, and thus likely makes the body ride lower, or possibly below the surface of the water. But, the fish sees the color/pattern of the hackle that we likely purchased because of that. As you can see above, the hackle the fish is seeing is slightly more golden, and the grizzly barring is visible. But will the body being subsurface absorb more water and cause the fly to sink faster?

The concave side facing down puts the hackle closer to the waters surface, which likely keeps the body riding in the surface film, or possibly even on top of the surface. But, the fish sees the underside of the feather, which you can see above lacks the grizzly barring, and is more of just a plain yellow hackle. If your trying to imitate some mottling, then obviously concave down isn't working. Does that matter that much to the fish? Does it outweigh having the body ride lower in the water?

I've been tying concave down forever, and don't seem to have a problem catching fish. I know this is probably one of those "who cares?" Or "if it ain't broke why fix it?" questions, but I really am interested in what other people's thoughts are on this!

I have no idea, but I really really like your flies...& the way you photograph them.

 

[James St. Clair]

I've always tied down because that seemed closer to what real legs actually do. That said, not sure there's enough curve to make enough of a difference?

Scott mentioned A.K.: I think in one of his books he makes a comment along the lines of BWO leg color and the common use of darker dun shades for hackle, but the legs actually being more creamy. And when we look at mayflies, how often are we turning them over? A lot of pale undersides but we tie the body out of the top-side color. We still catch tons of fish on them. (And in a severely back-lit situation, how much color/shade/tone can fish even differentiate?) Anyway, fun to think about.

Here's a BWO. Not saying they're all like this--there are so many species in this group--but I'll admit to never having tied one with a light gray abdomen, brown thorax, and cream-tan-ginger legs.

View attachment 52331

Totally man. After turning a bunch of Baetis (another common error, that is a Beatis, not a BWO, although some use the term interchangeably) over, I realized they were a pale creamy olive color, rather than just OLIVE. Additionally, the legs can range from a super light dun to a pale yellow. So I tie mine with a super light olive, almost cream dubbing, and either a light ginger or honey dun hackle. These are Central Washington Baetis though...

For a trip to the Green River l had last year, I posted some pics on the Insta, tagging the guide service we were going to use. I got a DM real quick that their Baetis were exactly as you described, more gray in color with light gray legs. I tied the rest of the flies for the trip in gray tones, and they did not dissapoint!

Sometimes I wonder if the concave down works better because it mutes the color of the actual hackle a bit, possibly more like we see in the naturals. But some bugs are pretty gawdy in terms of color expression. Maybe in those cases concave up is better?

 

[James St. Clair]

What do people like to use as the parachute? Calf tail, poly yarn or?

I've really been liking synthetic dubbing with light flash lately. Fly Tyers Dungeon BGD dubbing (cut in half), and Fly Fish Food's Bruiseer blend Jr. Dubbing both have worked really well for me. The minute flash sometimes catches light and helps with visibility, and I haven't noticed a difference in flotation. I also like that it is a little slimmer to tie the post even when using a good amount of material.

That being said, congo hair kicks butt too!

 

[James St. Clair]

What's everyone's though process for when to use split tailing fibers vs. single clump hackle fibers? For whatever reason I have so much more confidence in a parachute fly that has split tailing fibers vs. clumped hackle fibers. The comparadun comes to mind. Or something like this as an example of how I prefer the tail to look:

Totally agree. I split all my tails nowadays. Even if it's hackle fibers. Not only for "realism", but I think it gives the fly more surface area for flotation, and helps the fly ride flush/land correctly as well. Hackle fibers/Coq de Leon are super easy to split with the little piece of thread you chopped off after just tying your thread on the hook!

 

[RCF]

I've really been liking synthetic dubbing with light flash lately. Fly Tyers Dungeon BGD dubbing (cut in half), and Fly Fish Food's Bruiseer blend Jr. Dubbing both have worked really well for me. The minute flash sometimes catches light and helps with visibility, and I haven't noticed a difference in flotation. I also like that it is a little slimmer to tie the post even when using a good amount of material.

That being said, congo hair kicks butt too!

I still use calf tail alot. Best bright white white there is IMHO... Never heard of Congo hair. Will have to check it out.

 

[Zak]

I still use calf tail alot. Best bright white white there is IMHO... Never heard of Congo hair. Will have to check it out.

I've occasionally use white turkey flats. Easy to spot on the water!

 

[mcswny]

I still use calf tail alot. Best bright white white there is IMHO... Never heard of Congo hair. Will have to check it out.

It's essentially the same as EP fibers but 1/3 the price. Purchased from the Fly Tyers Dungeon.