NFR Buy on the Crypto Dip?

[SurfnFish]

"In essence, crypto assets are merely codes that are stored and accessed electronically. They may or may not be backed by physical or financial collateral. Their value may or may not be stabilized by being pegged to the value of fiat currencies or other prices or items of value."

Regulating Crypto

The right rules could provide a safe space for innovation

www.imf.org

Which is Warren Buffet's view, what is the value in crypto other than the other owners enthusiasm for it?

Warren Buffett gives his most expansive explanation for why he doesn't believe in bitcoin

Despite a shift in public perception about the cryptocurrency, Buffett still wouldn't buy bitcoin.

www.cnbc.com

Cryto and start-up tech stocks, both are bets based on the potential run-up...best played by those who can afford the losses as well as the wins.

 

[Old Man]

I read recently, 25% of the people in this country don't have a retirement plan. Working til they die is their plan?
37% of people with savings, don't and won't have enough money to retire and maintain their lifestyle.

Sad to think many people in this country are gonna work til death or retire and wait for death.

I retired at 64. I wasn't rich but I had a roof over my head and my belly was always full. I had 40,000 bucks when I retired. That disappeared in a few years I got a pension when I retired and I got SS. My wife gets SS so between us we live all right. Now if my useless son in law would get up off his lazy ass and get a paying job instead of trying to be a Salesman. And my wife would quit supporting them, I could afford to eat steak more than once a month.

This has nothing to do with what the thread is about. But if I can retire at 64 and still be alive at 87 says something.

 

[Mossback]

So Much For FTX Arena | Defector

The Miami Heat are not the only sports organization distancing themselves from the collapsing crypto exchange.

defector.com

 

[Emily27]

Thought this was a fun watch, it felt like a pretty reasonable criticism of the crypto world.

 

[DimeBrite]

The market cap of all crypto currencies stands at $824 billion as of today. The zenith was $3 trillion. The 2020-2021 COVID-FED bailout crypto bubble has been eradicated. Clearly there are more losses to come. US stocks seem "safe" in comparison.

 

[RCF]

It just got uglier:

Customer funds used on margin for investments without customer knowledge.

Sam Bankman-Fried’s Alameda quietly used FTX customer funds for trading, say sources

Sam Bankman-Fried's trading firm was able to quietly use customer funds from his exchange FTX without sounding alarm bells, sources say.

www.cnbc.com

 

[Capt Insano Emeritis]

It seems piss-poor long-term financial planning as a way of life for most Americans.
I have friends that are going to rely solely on their social security check when they retire.
How do you work from 16 to 60 and not have enough money saved up to do the things you were dreaming of( while at work) after retirement is mind-boggling.

Work for a non profit, wife worked in retail. 2 kids buy a small house when interest was super high. Refi 4 times put kids through college. Then get divorced and divide assets. Lose a career or two…Yada yada yada yada soon to be 70… be mind boggled if ya want. That scenario is incredibly common today. You were trolling weren’t you? Wink…sorta meh

 

[TicTokCroc]

Work for a non profit, wife worked in retail. 2 kids buy a small house when interest was super high. Refi 4 times put kids through college. Then get divorced and divide assets. Lose a career or two…Yada yada yada yada soon to be 70… be mind boggled if ya want. That scenario is incredibly common today. You were trolling weren’t you? Wink…sorta meh

You could also have open heart surgery at age 32 that totally ef's up your union pension career.

 

[_WW_]

You could also have open heart surgery at age 32 that totally ef's up your union pension career.

Or you could be dead.

 

[Old Man]

I guess that get rich quick thing made a few people poorer. My gosh.

 

[TicTokCroc]

Or you could be dead.

That's adding to the point Mr Insano was making. Lots of variables can happen that interfere with retirement plans. Believe me I'm much happier to be alive then continuing adding to my pension. I can't legally commercial drive any more but I'm much happier working for myself.. We'll figure the retirement thing out eventually or not. Crypto will be a part of it

 

[nwbobber]

Peter Lynch said not to invest in something where you don't really understand where the value comes from. My hat is off to anyone who can... I think there are damn few with the education to grasp how this works, let alone how to monetize a technology that works like this. I believe this will be a very useful tool, but not as a currency. As a currency it is completely dependent on the moods and psychological quirks of humans. My retirement funds are doing fine invested in tech, energy, healthcare, durables, metals, and the like. Things I can understand. I won't get rich quick, and it wasn't quick earning the money that is invested.

Best advice I have for the younger ones here is start saving early, invest on a schedule, like it was a payment you had to make, invest in strong companies that produce products of quality that people need, and will likely continue to need in the future. If you do that, you will not need to invest in something promising quick money, which historically have been part of nearly all the stories of major losses. If you have play money that you might bet on a horserace knowing you could lose it all, and you'll still be all right.... take a chance on the next big thing like crypto.

 

[Evan B]

Peter Lynch said not to invest in something where you don't really understand where the value comes from. My hat is off to anyone who can... I think there are damn few with the education to grasp how this works, let alone how to monetize a technology that works like this. I believe this will be a very useful tool, but not as a currency. As a currency it is completely dependent on the moods and psychological quirks of humans. My retirement funds are doing fine invested in tech, energy, healthcare, durables, metals, and the like. Things I can understand. I won't get rich quick, and it wasn't quick earning the money that is invested.

Best advice I have for the younger ones here is start saving early, invest on a schedule, like it was a payment you had to make, invest in strong companies that produce products of quality that people need, and will likely continue to need in the future. If you do that, you will not need to invest in something promising quick money, which historically have been part of nearly all the stories of major losses. If you have play money that you might bet on a horserace knowing you could lose it all, and you'll still be all right.... take a chance on the next big thing like crypto.

The problem for us milennials and younger is that we don't make enough money to invest in amounts that will amount to a meaningful retirement sum. I've been running the numbers for years, and unless I turn this forum in to a million dollar a year endeavor that the three of us split, pay taxes on, etc etc and pay ourselves out... I'll never make enough to put nearly enough away each month to retire on with traditional investments. I did that for years, and eventually decided to start swinging for the fences.

Thankfully I'm good at this, and have several years of making sound decisions. I've already paid myself out for far more than I have put in, so it's all house money for me now. And despite the current bloodbath (actually, because of it), I am feeling pretty good about the outlook.

I also understand the tech and actively am involved with a few projects, so I have a different view on it than most.

I've probably already posted this, but I think it's probably the best, base-level intro to things. Personally, I am involved with a lot of things that differ a great deal from BTC, but the base tech is essentially the same. They have just found a lot of other use-cases for blockchain since this video has come out. Still, he makes some great points about what money is and can be.
(this was from 2016, which is around when I started getting really in to this stuff)

 

[nwbobber]

The problem for us milennials and younger is that we don't make enough money to invest in amounts that will amount to a meaningful retirement sum. I've been running the numbers for years, and unless I turn this forum in to a million dollar a year endeavor that the three of us split, pay taxes on, etc etc and pay ourselves out... I'll never make enough to put nearly enough away each month to retire on with traditional investments. I did that for years, and eventually decided to start swinging for the fences.

Thankfully I'm good at this, and have several years of making sound decisions. I've already paid myself out for far more than I have put in, so it's all house money for me now. And despite the current bloodbath (actually, because of it), I am feeling pretty good about the outlook.

I also understand the tech and actively am involved with a few projects, so I have a different view on it than most.

I've probably already posted this, but I think it's probably the best, base-level intro to things. Personally, I am involved with a lot of things that differ a great deal from BTC, but the base tech is essentially the same. They have just found a lot of other use-cases for blockchain since this video has come out. Still, he makes some great points about what money is and can be.
(this was from 2016, which is around when I started getting really in to this stuff)

I hope you take some of the profits and diversify into more traditional assets. You may do well with your crypto strategy, but mass psychosis has wiped out markets in the past and will in the future. Diverse investments are the best insurance that you get to hold on to your gains (or some of them) and use them to fight another day. I do take a look at crypto from time to time, but I'm at the age that risk is not what I'm looking for. I have enough to get by on if I don't lose what I have.
I think younger folks, myself included if I look back, often think they don't have enough to invest. Almost anyone can do it if they set their mind to. My wife tells the kids ninety cents is almost a dollar, if you can make it on what you make you can make it on 90% of it. Invest 10%, and do it religiously. It's more important than owning a boat or a big screen TV. You can still have a boat and a tv, just a little more modest. If you just can't make yourself do 10% do 5%, with a plan to increase it every year. You'll definitely get used to living within the means you set for yourself.

 

[Evan B]

I hope you take some of the profits and diversify into more traditional assets. You may do well with your crypto strategy, but mass psychosis has wiped out markets in the past and will in the future. Diverse investments are the best insurance that you get to hold on to your gains (or some of them) and use them to fight another day. I do take a look at crypto from time to time, but I'm at the age that risk is not what I'm looking for. I have enough to get by on if I don't lose what I have.
I think younger folks, myself included if I look back, often think they don't have enough to invest. Almost anyone can do it if they set their mind to. My wife tells the kids ninety cents is almost a dollar, if you can make it on what you make you can make it on 90% of it. Invest 10%, and do it religiously. It's more important than owning a boat or a big screen TV. You can still have a boat and a tv, just a little more modest. If you just can't make yourself do 10% do 5%, with a plan to increase it every year. You'll definitely get used to living within the means you set for yourself.

I do diversify my assets, and my wife's salary is putting 5% away in a 401k (she's the real breadwinner), we got in to the housing market at a great time (after the 2008 crash), which is not something most my peers get to say for themselves. We still won't have enough to retire on, not even close. We live very modestly, only get vehicles we can buy with cash, and the boat I have is one that I got on the cheap and restored after flipping a few other restoration projects. While we don't live lavishly, I also am a big believer in enjoying life while your young/younger, and refuse to support this notion of living on bare minimums until we're too old to enjoy living the life we want to live.

Everything I have/do is a DIY project for the most part just to save money. With the way cost of living has been/continues to be for my generation since we entered the workforce, it's going to be VERY hard for most of us to retire unless we get lucky with a windfall of money somewhere. I'm doing what I can to increase my chances for that to happen.

 

[DimeBrite]

The U.S. Treasury Yield-Curve Recession Indicator Is Flashing Red​

Yield-curve inversion is at its most extreme since the 1981-82 recession.


Uh oh! Time to batten down the financial hatches! GenY and GenZ will soon get to experience their first severe and lengthy recession. Even Bezos is cautioning folks and small business to cut spending and strengthen their finances ahead of 2023.

 

[RCF]

For many of us investment vehicles did not come out until later in life. 401k's came into being in early 1980's. They replaced company pensions in most cases (if you were fortunate enough to work for a company that provided a pension) and also provided a way to boost retirement funds with company matching funds. Roth IRA's came into being around 2000. Both of these supported saving/investing at an earlier age so that compounding our funds from an earlier age became a reality - which I hope we all can agree on is how to save more/enough for retirement. Taking proper advantage of the tax-deferred growth (401k/IRA) and tax-free investment withdrawal (Roth IRA) vehicles is very important.

I also believe in having some 'play' money for risky/shoot-for- the-moon investments. Much better having some money there to scratch the 'itch' than to do that with your main investments for retirement. Does one get lucky to hit a great investment? Most likely not but if you do make sure it is in the proper investment vehicle so that it does not get eaten alive by government taxes.

 

[Evan B]

For many of us investment vehicles did not come out until later in life. 401k's came into being in early 1980's. They replaced company pensions in most cases (if you were fortunate enough to work for a company that provided a pension) and also provided a way to boost retirement funds with company matching funds. Roth IRA's came into being around 2000. Both of these supported saving/investing at an earlier age so that compounding our funds from an earlier age became a reality - which I hope we all can agree on is how to save more/enough for retirement. Taking proper advantage of the tax-deferred growth (401k/IRA) and tax-free investment withdrawal (Roth IRA) vehicles is very important.

I also believe in having some 'play' money for risky/shoot-for- the-moon investments. Much better having some money there to scratch the 'itch' than to do that with your main investments for retirement. Does one get lucky to hit a great investment? Most likely not but if you do make sure it is in the proper investment vehicle so that it does not get eaten alive by government taxes.

Right, they're all great ideas in theory, but my point was that the younger generations don't have enough "extra" money for their contributions to amount to anything meaningful. Living paycheck to paycheck while not owning a home, and sharing a house with a half dozen roommates is becoming more the norm for those currently in their 20s. By contrast, my parents owned a home at 18 and could afford a few kids on low wages.

It takes a pretty decent amount from each paycheck for retirement contributions to have any hope of being anything meaningful, and that's the part most lack right now.

 

[RCF]

I have several kids that recently graduated from college. I see what they are going through on a daily basis and fully(?) understand the dilemma. I look at the challenges facing them. They are taking advantage of the 401k's available to them. Making 50% matching employer funds on the money they save is nothing to sneeze at. While they are not putting a lot of money into the 401k (due to lower salary), it is adding up over time and, with compounding, hopefully it will be sizeable someday.

What I do not get are families with newer and nicer cars yet their kids are on the 'free lunch program' at school. This is not one or two families but a lot more than you would guess/believe.

My belief is that if one does not start young with planning and saving for retirement, they will not have sufficient funds later in life. Saving a little paycheck to paycheck (maybe $25 or $30) is better that not saving at all. IMHO it comes down to prioritization. Give up a little now (instant satisfaction) for a better life for oneself, their spouse, and their family in the long run.

 

[Coach Potter]

Right, they're all great ideas in theory, but my point was that the younger generations don't have enough "extra" money for their contributions to amount to anything meaningful. Living paycheck to paycheck while not owning a home, and sharing a house with a half dozen roommates is becoming more the norm for those currently in their 20s. By contrast, my parents owned a home at 18 and could afford a few kids on low wages.

It takes a pretty decent amount from each paycheck for retirement contributions to have any hope of being anything meaningful, and that's the part most lack right now.

What does retirement look like in your mind? I have been involved in helping at least 150-200 folks retire in the last 25 years and very few of them look the same.