Philosomophizing about fishing

A good topic. IMO, a lot of similarities between gambling and fishing. If it were just about getting fish, we could do that in the grocery store. What we're really chasing is that dopamine hit we get from a strike, like hitting the jackpot while gambling.
 
I hit it hard when the fish are there and conditions favorable. Also, I tend to put most iof my effort with high reward fisheries, season and locations. If it is slow, I usually wrap up early to do something else, but return frequently so I hit it when it goes off. Not really gambling so much as playing the odds.
 
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DimeBrite said:
Not really gambling so much as playing the odds.
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I do enjoy blackjack, and that's what I tell myself. At least I can usually come out somewhere near even if not ahead there. Always the low bet table.
 
We tend to fish in the style that we enjoy most, whether it is the most effective or not. I know that fish eat subsurface 80% of the time, so I fish that way also…but watching a big trout smash a mouse is a lot more fun than dredging a deep pool with heavy nymph…
 
Brute said:
We tend to fish in the style that we enjoy most, whether it is the most effective or not. I know that fish eat subsurface 80% of the time, so I fish that way also…but watching a big trout smash a mouse is a lot more fun than dredging a deep pool with heavy nymph…
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There's a reason I try to toss a big-ass popper for tigers an hour or two each session....hasn't happened yet, but when it does!!!
 
Brute said:
We tend to fish in the style that we enjoy most, whether it is the most effective or not. I know that fish eat subsurface 80% of the time, so I fish that way also…but watching a big trout smash a mouse is a lot more fun than dredging a deep pool with heavy nymph…
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At dusk smashing a mouse off a rock wall with a splash into the water is not gambling. It is money!!!

The only gamble is if my tippet will weather the smash and grab...
 
Great discussion, all. And weird coincidences, too!
The thought was really more about the idea of “trying our luck” which can certainly include playing the odds. But as to the dry-flies-don’t-catch-as-much thing, I really like fishing dries at times when they are effective and so I go to North Idahontana the week after July 4th and fish for westslope cutts in the well known places. I honestly do better with dries than anything else at these times, and it’s not for not trying nymphs and streamers. And I can catch some fish with nymphs and streamers; I do it plenty. I’ve posted the little loop wing CDC fly I tie here before. That thing is cutthroat crack. They want the dry this time of year. Well, at least my dry. :cool:
 
This is how it works.
Tie on your favorite dry fly and stand on the river bank and watch the river move by.
If you have been fishing rivers for a few years you kinda know where the trout hang out.
I like to work the water if I don't see fish rising.
Start at the tail of the pool or pocket and work my way up to the prime spot.
Same for seams.
No gambling, work all the water, four or five casts and move on.
I have been using the same dry fly pattern for every fishing trip to my local rivers and streams for years. In fact I like to use that pattern in MT, ID, WA, everywhere there are trout in the river.
Some days I catch lots some days few.
Just being on the water is what is important.
 
dirty dog said:
I have been using the same dry fly pattern for every fishing trip to my local rivers and streams for years. In fact I like to use that pattern in MT, ID, WA, everywhere there are trout in the river.
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Can we see a picture of it? Or even a recipe?
 
dirty dog said:
If you have been fishing rivers for a few years you kinda know where the trout hang out.
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Especially if you’ve fished the Yakima. I’m not very experienced with that river/rivers in general, but it seems like the fish are in the same spots trip after trip after trip.
 
Matt B said:
I had several days of trout fishing recently, and I stuck with the dry all throughout and did well. Had to cover a lot of water to find the “big fish” that wanted to eat, though. It got me thinking that fishing like that, maybe fishing in general, is like gambling. I’m not a gambler, but sure love to fish and each time I put that dry over a new lie was like a little bet. Seemingly random positive reinforcement (nothing, nothing, dink, nothing, nothing, nothing, BINGO) keeps me wanting more, wanting to try more and more until I hit it big.

I don’t know, what do you think of my theory?

Busy week but I’ll get a report up soon I hope.
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I've had exactly the same thought about fishing. I also never gamble. I put one quarter in a slot machine once in my early 20s, won about $50, and decided that I was ahead for life and didn't need to gamble any more.

I like the gambling analogy for the sense of expectation and random reward, but it breaks down when I think about the downside of gambling. When I'm fishing, I'm winning whether I catch fish or not. There's no downside, it's all great being outdoors, hopefully becoming more skilled, and having some alone time or time with friends. So for me, fishing has many of the things that gamblers seek, with none of the deficits.
 
Matt B said:
Seemingly random positive reinforcement (nothing, nothing, dink, nothing, nothing, nothing, BINGO) keeps me wanting more, wanting to try more and more until I hit it big.

I don’t know, what do you think of my theory?
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IIRC from Psych 101, the term you're looking for is "Variable Schedule of Reinforcement".

Turns out not knowing when the reward is coming is the most powerful behavior reinforcement of all. Which explains the similar addictive effects with gambling... minus the ash tray smells and laws of statistics being stacked against you. But I'm with you in that fishing seems a far more philosophical addiction.
 
To me Fly fishing can be one of those peak experiences where you can be totally concentrated, mind and body connected. Playing music in a great group, sex with the right lover, and some other physical activities (skiing, basketball when I was a kid) have the same qualities. I'm not so sure about gambling. It seems to be more about drinking and losing money (slowly if your good at it). If you get the right combination in fly fishing can almost be a sure thing. It certainly isn't every day (except for a few places that shall not be named), but the idea is to find the key to reapeated success, something that doesn't happen in gambling. Unless you have lots of money and are great at counting cards, the house will always win in the long run. I hope we have all had days where almost every cast results in a take. That why I prefer fishing drys to rising fish where you can figure out the pattern and make it repeat, something that won't happen gambling.
 
Bakerite said:
To me Fly fishing can be one of those peak experiences where you can be totally concentrated, mind and body connected. Playing music in a great group, sex with the right lover, and some other physical activities (skiing, basketball when I was a kid) have the same qualities. I'm not so sure about gambling. It seems to be more about drinking and losing money (slowly if your good at it). If you get the right combination in fly fishing can almost be a sure thing. It certainly isn't every day (except for a few places that shall not be named), but the idea is to find the key to reapeated success, something that doesn't happen in gambling. Unless you have lots of money and are great at counting cards, the house will always win in the long run. I hope we have all had days where almost every cast results in a take. That why I prefer fishing drys to rising fish where you can figure out the pattern and make it repeat, something that won't happen gambling.
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Yes! Fishing is one of those activities that keeps me completely in the moment, totally absorbed in what I am doing. But somehow, it also has enough mental pauses or allows enough "auto-pilot" that things sort of process in the background at the same time.
 
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Zak said:
Can we see a picture of it? Or even a recipe?
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Yellow Sally X on a #12 2x long straight eye hook.
Yellow thread, yellow poly yarn, leave a short tail on the hook bend with the yarn, fine gold wire, grizzly hackle tied forward, gold wire counter wrapped to hold down hackle, green or gray crazy legs tied in an X, wing elk hair, tied like for a caddis fly.
Sorry I'm unable to post a pic
 
dirty dog said:
Yellow Sally X on a #12 2x long straight eye hook.
Yellow thread, yellow poly yarn, leave a short tail on the hook bend with the yarn, fine gold wire, grizzly hackle tied forward, gold wire counter wrapped to hold down hackle, green or gray crazy legs tied in an X, wing elk hair, tied like for a caddis fly.
Sorry I'm unable to post a pic
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Thanks! Sounds like a winner!
 
I have an analogy regarding fishing compared to gambling. Winning (or catching) only makes the urge to gamble (or to continue to fish) more intense. I knew a compulsive gambler. One night she won $1700. Enough to pay her back rent with money left over. Did she leave the casino? No. She lost it all before going home. She was never satiated. When I am fishing and finally land that personal best fish.. I cast out again the very next minute. I have often struggled with just taking a break to enjoy my "winnings".
 
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Jim in Anacortes said:
I have an analogy regarding fishing compared to gambling. Winning (or catching) only makes the urge to gamble (or to continue to fish) more intense. I knew a compulsive gambler. One night she won $1700. Enough to pay her back rent with money left over. Did she leave the casino? No. She lost it all before going home. She was never satiated. When I am fishing and finally land that personal best fish.. I cast out again the very next minute. I have often struggled with just enjoying my "winnings".
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I can relate to that sometimes. But other times, I can be like Costanza and leave on a high note. “I’m out!”

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Matt B those are the best times to be a gambler or a fisherman. A few day ago I was fishing Pass Lake with a gurgler. Caught a nice Rainbow that smashed it when I least expected. I said to myself "All right. That's it for me".
 
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