Grizzly Attack (another one)

[jasmillo]

To be fair we have cherry picked the aquatic food chain, and left some of it with poor conservation efforts. In part due to blanket regulation that do not correctly address problems. I’ve made my opinion clear on the double dipping of tribe actions before, debate is still out on boogeyman

As much of a bummer the interaction with the Montana fisherman is for the griz, packing saved their lives.

It’s a new world though….

I have no issues with outdoorsman using anything at their disposal to protect themselves when in that situation. It’s the proactive consideration of eradication of the species from their current and former ranges that I have an issue with.

 

[_WW_]

I disagree. You cannot baby safe the world. At some point adults need to make decisions considering the risks involved. We do it in our everyday lives as we should when we decide to enjoy hunting and fishing. A lot of things can kill you. Being attacked and eaten by a grizzly bear, as awful as that would be, should be quite low on the list of one’s worries while enjoying the outdoors if the right precautions are taken. Even for those of us who recreate often in regions where they reside.

Not going to debate the one human more valuable than every grizzly comment. That’s a religious point of view and though I disagree, respect your right to have it.

Did I ever tell you guys about that time when I was a kid and rode my bike in the street without a helmet, knee pads, spandex, shin guards, and a flashing light...after dark! I was lucky to get out of that trip home from swimming in the river, handling live frogs, snakes, roadkill, and climbing huge cottonwood trees alive!

 

[Rob Allen]

I know. You have all the answers to every fishing, hunting and conservation quandary. Is it possible some of the science may have changed in 50 years? Maybe that is why the lawsuit was successful? I honestly don’t know the answer to that but a simple question to consider.

If only life was as simple as you try and make it out to be. All good Rob, no interest in debating this on the forum. It’s been done too many times before.

That said, when it comes to this issue, I am a flag waving, no apology giving, bad person. I hope you don’t hold that against me personally as I don’t hold your views against you.

We do agree on one thing; outdoorsman’s should be able to protect themselves in the field, outside of putting grizzlies right back in the same place that got them listed in the first place. IMO of course….

The science isn't 50 years old.. it's current.

I've watched the elk herd in my backyard dwindle from 25-30 healthy animals to now, one old lone cow due to the foot rot that I first saw in 1998. What elk hunters need around here is some predators to clean up the diseased animals and let the herd rebuild naturally. I don't worry about bears when I'm in the woods, I treat them with respect, and I think I'm more likely to win the lottery than have a problem. I enjoy the outdoors for what the creator put there, and I am more often than not disappointed when I can see what the hand of man has left out there.
Rob you have more faith in humanity than I do if you think that allowing hunters to kill any predator with no questions asked would not go completely sideways.

I have absolutely no faith in man at all. But I prefer dead grizzlies to dead humans.

My only point is that greater Yellowstone grizzlies should be de-listed. Why? Because the biologists say that the population threshold that all parties agreed to have been surpassed. Including the parties who are now suing to stop the de-listing.

Imagine the Skagit went 10 years with a wild winter steelhead run of 30,000 fish with no sign of going down. Imagine furthermore that WDFW and NMFS both agreed that a catch and release season was complete warranted but the Humane Society sued and got the season blocked.... that's more or less what's going on here.
Except that not having a catch and release season doesn't kill people.

Judges shouldn't rule on science, they should rule based on law.. why? Because that's their one and ONLY job.

 

[CRO]

Sadly the couple in Canada that were killed had bear spray that didnt deter that bear. I read that one of the 2 cans was found empty. Canadas strict firearms laws make it make it difficult to carry sidearms for protection.

 

[Brian Miller]

Some data

Greater Yellowstone grizzly attacks remain rare, despite high-profile encounters

After two recent, high-profile grizzly attacks in the Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem and a media ecosystem that amplifies news of attacks nationwide, grizzly researchers say attacks are up — modestly.

www.jhnewsandguide.com

(A one and done reading before you hit the paywall)

51 Grizzly Mortalities, Deadliest Year On Record For Montana Bears

2018 has been the deadliest year since scientists started keeping track for grizzlies in Northwest Montana."We did have a record high number of…

www.mtpr.org

This comment was included in the article: "...51 mortalities doesn’t mean 51 dead bears. For scientists, a mortality is any grizzly that leaves the ecosystem."
That could be contributing to the recent orange and blue numbers in the chart above.

Grizzly bear encounters in southwest Montana increase from recent years

MONTANA FISH, WILDLIFE & PARKS BOZEMAN — Recreationists in southwest Montana reported having more encounters with grizzly bears in 2019 than in recent years. Montana’s portion of the Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem... READ MORE

www.explorebigsky.com

The last chart is an interesting comparison about Human Injuries and Related Bear Deaths per encounter
The numbers in the chart are probably small for the amount of people visiting the study area.
But the data seems to show that a significant number of humans are being injured, and the bears encountered are being killed, for EACH ENCOUNTER.

 

[jasmillo]

From the little I read of the incident the OP referenced to start this thread, the couple appears to have done everything right but still were attacked. Unfortunate but a risk we all take on when recreating in grizzled country.

That said, humans also have to do a better job doing the right thing themselves when recreating around wildlife.

How about this guy. Screenshot taken off the Brooks Camp bear cams 10 minutes ago (sorry, bad glare on TV). If there is anywhere in the world you can get away with this, it’s Brooks Camp. That said, still not anywhere near smart. His fly line came into the picture before he did. Hooked up, he followed a fish between three bears versus breaking it off and calling it good…



Or this genius near a mother black bear and cubs at YNP this spring. At times, within 15 feet or so of a mother and cubs with her back to them, fixing her hair so she could take a selfie .



There were actually a bunch of brainiacs at this bear jam.



So many examples at YNP it’s hard to recount them all every year. My favorites are the multiple girls I have seen laying in the grass, feet from full grown male bison to take a selfie. Don’t know why that seems to be a thing. Maybe Kim Kardashian did it once and now everyone needs the same shot…

 

[Mossback]