Experience as a guide?

[flybill]

Many, many different fisheries in the US and World, there isn't really a "single take" on what it is like to be a fishing guide. In the "salmonid guide" ecosystem alone, there is staggering variation in what makes for a good program, even within the same geographic region...kinda tough to generalize about the experience.

Coming off my 21st season as a guide, and at 54, I'm tired. A 165 day sunup to sundown season with a handful of days off is for kids, not folks with AARP cards and retirement plans. I'm in the twilight of my career, but here are a few (mostly random) thoughts...
I haven't pulled a 45-day-er in a couple years, but I still remember occasionally falling asleep at the vise at midnight while crankin' out a few dozen bugs for my next trip in less than 6hrs...I also remember spending a LOT of plane flights tying leaders and doing other rigging, much to the chagrin of the pilots.
I once taught my wife how to tie saltwater loop knots to pre-tie tippet sections for me by the hundred, and when I was in the midle of the 450-500 guests-a-season years (2012-2019) I had to pay her to do my laundry.
I've been there for awkward family meltdowns, and been treated as the sounding board and unwilling confidante for all kinds of shit people somehow think they need to unload on a semi-stranger in the middle of the wilderness.
I've guided some of the wealthiest humans on the planet, and I've guided folks who have saved for years to afford a half-day trip.
I've had the pleasure of having a front-row seat as some of the best practitioners of flycasting on the planet have fished my waters.
I've guided a ton of folks of the "I know how to fly fish, I don't need your help" persuasion (mostly middle-aged white guys), and I've also had the distinct pleasure of introducing hundreds of folks to flyfishing.
I've watched friendships and relationships bloom and blossom on my trips, and I've also been there when the other shoe drops, so to speak.
I've had to administer CPR and beyond-basic first aid in wilderness settings.
I've been lucky enough to log thousands of hours in floatplanes all over Alaska, and been paid handsomely for that experience.
I've had to run past guests to get in between them and angry bears, because...that's my job.
I've had the pleasure of taking more than 6,000 people fishing in Alaska, and I can count the number of folks who were truly irredeemable assholes on one hand...wouldn't even need all the fingers.
I've learned how to catch salmonids consistently, easily, and repeatably under every condition imaginable. I've watched and dissected fish and fishing behavior for thousands upon thousands of hours, and come up with tools and techiques for the success of other anglers, independent of my presence/coaching
Over the years, I have learned to manage the expectations, emotions, and idiosyncrasies of my guests, and learned a lot about myself in the process.
I've learned how to connect deeply and commucicate openly, concisely, and fully on a compressed timeline with otherwise total strangers, and made some long and lasting friendships with guests over the years.
Through the "Guide's Union", I have met a vast number of exceptional individals with shared passion and experience, in some cases forming instantaneous and lasting bonds much like fellow trauma survivors...
I've had days where I was the king of the world, and I've had days where I did my best to keep my shit together in the view of my guests.

Was it all worth it?
In the long run, probably.

If given the chance, would I do it all over again, every single day exactly like I already did it?
AbsoFuckingLutely.

Would I reccomend it to anyone else?
Nope.

View attachment 87401

While I haven't been a guide, as a casting instructor and with my time at Orvis Bellevue and elsewhere, I've been tempted more than a few time to work as a part time "guide"! In the end, in order to do it I would need to shed some weight and work on a few things.. get a boat and a raft.. more rods.. yada yada yada..

I've been guided and mentored by some of the best in the PNW! Leland Miyawaki, Derek Brown, Mike Kinney, Brian Paige, John Lease, guides at Reds, Ryan White and Bob Triggs to name a few. OMJ was my GPS (Grumpy Phucker System).. I have one of his marked up Gazetters... RIP OMJ!

Next year, I'll be going to AK to teach a dear friend and her girlfriend to fly fish. I won't "guide" them, but teach them to cast and fish on a rod that I'm building for her. I love to teach, fly fishing and even golf believe it or not.

I don't know the exact timeframe, but my friend is from Colorado, and her family has a house up in AK. She'll be there for a month.. I'll go up for at least a week!

Best fishes! FlyBill

 

[Paige]

Almost 10 yrs and was a ton of fun!
Butt, the hardest job I've ever had, not physically, but mentally.
Paid for 8 hrs, worked 12 -14 hrs and not encluding tying flies. Better be single and willing to travel, A LOT, even in a single state, but most will need to do it in multiple states to survive!

Baby sitting clients that cant cast, cant wade, or wont listen to instruction, or know more than you but cant execute!
Don't forget the true Ass Holes that are better than you, that have done it all, know it all. Been there, done that, but then cant back up a single thing!
But your a bad guide!

Guiding in WA is a lost cause, except on the Yakima, Steelhead forget about it that ship sailed back in the 90's.

G_smolt summed it up pretty well!

Would 100% do b it again, but solely in AK, WA is fucked!

 

[flybill]

Almost 10 yrs and was a ton of fun!
Butt, the hardest job I've ever had, not physically, but mentally.
Paid for 8 hrs, worked 12 -14 hrs and not encluding tying flies. Better be single and willing to travel, A LOT, even in a single state, but most will need to do it in multiple states to survive!

Baby sitting clients that cant cast, cant wade, or wont listen to instruction, or know more than you but cant execute!
Don't forget the true Ass Holes that are better than you, that have done it all, know it all. Been there, done that, but then cant back up a single thing!
But your a bad guide!

Guiding in WA is a lost cause, except on the Yakima, Steelhead forget about it that ship sailed back in the 90's.

G_smolt summed it up pretty well!

Would 100% do b it again, but solely in AK, WA is fucked!

Sad but true on steelhead! Lakes and Sea run cutthroat trout guiding for the wet side of the mountains.. then the Yakima.. or just head to Montana! Missouri River you're calling me..

 

[WaterDragon]

I can't speak to the guide's experience, only know what some who have, have told me. But based on that...

As in any industry, expect to start at the bottom and only very slowly work up in position - meaning working for an outfitter either full time as the grunt or available for last minute bookings; to guide in Montana for example - there's an outfitter's license which requires years of demonstrated experience. Those who rise to the top with years' out bookings, particularly in someplace like Montana, are few.

Also as in any service industry, at some point you'll face the issues of lack of money saved as you reach retirement age. For example, I have friends in the hair salon industry facing that now. Never paid much attention to it - until having less than five years to work. You need to be wealthy or have a spouse with a regular job and benefits (health insurance for example).

 

[flybill]

A few of my favorite pictures fishing with and learning from Brian and Ron!!

 

[FishyJere]

I dabbled in it after retirement, enough to decide I wanted to fish when I wanted to, where I wanted to and with whom I wanted tol

 

[Solduc]

I’ve been told “guiding for a living is a way to die broke and lonely. “

 

[Brute]

Many, many different fisheries in the US and World, there isn't really a "single take" on what it is like to be a fishing guide. In the "salmonid guide" ecosystem alone, there is staggering variation in what makes for a good program, even within the same geographic region...kinda tough to generalize about the experience.

Coming off my 21st season as a guide, and at 54, I'm tired. A 165 day sunup to sundown season with a handful of days off is for kids, not folks with AARP cards and retirement plans. I'm in the twilight of my career, but here are a few (mostly random) thoughts...
I haven't pulled a 45-day-er in a couple years, but I still remember occasionally falling asleep at the vise at midnight while crankin' out a few dozen bugs for my next trip in less than 6hrs...I also remember spending a LOT of plane flights tying leaders and doing other rigging, much to the chagrin of the pilots.
I once taught my wife how to tie saltwater loop knots to pre-tie tippet sections for me by the hundred, and when I was in the midle of the 450-500 guests-a-season years (2012-2019) I had to pay her to do my laundry.
I've been there for awkward family meltdowns, and been treated as the sounding board and unwilling confidante for all kinds of shit people somehow think they need to unload on a semi-stranger in the middle of the wilderness.
I've guided some of the wealthiest humans on the planet, and I've guided folks who have saved for years to afford a half-day trip.
I've had the pleasure of having a front-row seat as some of the best practitioners of flycasting on the planet have fished my waters.
I've guided a ton of folks of the "I know how to fly fish, I don't need your help" persuasion (mostly middle-aged white guys), and I've also had the distinct pleasure of introducing hundreds of folks to flyfishing.
I've watched friendships and relationships bloom and blossom on my trips, and I've also been there when the other shoe drops, so to speak.
I've had to administer CPR and beyond-basic first aid in wilderness settings.
I've been lucky enough to log thousands of hours in floatplanes all over Alaska, and been paid handsomely for that experience.
I've had to run past guests to get in between them and angry bears, because...that's my job.
I've had the pleasure of taking more than 6,000 people fishing in Alaska, and I can count the number of folks who were truly irredeemable assholes on one hand...wouldn't even need all the fingers.
I've learned how to catch salmonids consistently, easily, and repeatably under every condition imaginable. I've watched and dissected fish and fishing behavior for thousands upon thousands of hours, and come up with tools and techiques for the success of other anglers, independent of my presence/coaching
Over the years, I have learned to manage the expectations, emotions, and idiosyncrasies of my guests, and learned a lot about myself in the process.
I've learned how to connect deeply and commucicate openly, concisely, and fully on a compressed timeline with otherwise total strangers, and made some long and lasting friendships with guests over the years.
Through the "Guide's Union", I have met a vast number of exceptional individals with shared passion and experience, in some cases forming instantaneous and lasting bonds much like fellow trauma survivors...
I've had days where I was the king of the world, and I've had days where I did my best to keep my shit together in the view of my guests.

Was it all worth it?
In the long run, probably.

If given the chance, would I do it all over again, every single day exactly like I already did it?
AbsoFuckingLutely.

Would I reccomend it to anyone else?
Nope.

View attachment 87401

I’ve fished with many guides over the years, some good, some mediocre, some bad…and a few exceptional ones. I suspect you are of the last type…

 

[Mossback]

Guides have a tough job most of the time, not one I would want...but lots of hard working folks who do a good job has been my general experience over the past 30 years or so of being guided/having guides as friends.

That being said, there's lazy morons in every profession, so finding that some guides are lazy morons is not surprising.

 

[JohnB]

I am wondering how many people on here are or where a fishing guide. If there are what are some of your experiences? What are the pros and cons of the job? Are there any stories that stand out to you while guiding? What advice would you give to someone who is thinking about getting in to it?

Clients vastly prefer to fish for salmon by using downriggers and they think mooching is dumb.

 

[Scudley Do Right]

Clients vastly prefer to fish for salmon by using downriggers and they think mooching is dumb.

I think you're confusing fishing with a boat ride. Most people don't know what mooching is.

 

[Scudley Do Right]

To be clear I am not seriously considering being a guide. I don't have the people skills for direct customer interaction. I was just curious but the info might help other who might be.

 

[Long_Rod_Silvers]

My wife's boss paid me to take him fishing one time because his daughter had recently caught a 20"er and he couldn't handle the fact that she had caught the biggest fish in the family. Pay was contingent on him catching a 20"+ fish (bigger than hers). Does that count?
Of course, I took him to a super duper top secret spot in which success was pretty much a guarantee.....

 

[Peyton00]

The above picture would be better if he was giving his daughter the middle finger with his left hand up by the Gill plate. Lol.

 

[DimeBrite]

Guiding must be a tough job, I can only imagine. Every once in awhile I will semi-guide an acquaintence or family member; it usually works out. I just like to do the fishing as well as the spotting, water reading, and situational awareness. As a client I've fished with a full spectrum of guide personalities, and try to make their job easier (listen to instruction, communicate what I'm seeing & doing, ask for clarification, spot fish on my own, always being ready to cast, etc). A profile of a few of the guides I've fished with:

- Chain smoking accusatory FLA tarpon guide who over uses the electric troll motor

- Totally silent (but deadly) Mayan flats guides with white mangrove push poles

- Kiribati flats guide with dissentary and a hang-over, but still spots fish all day and wades 8 miles

- Action hero, super zealous and intense South African flats guides in tights. These guys are impressive as hell.

- African guides who put you in the zone then vanish, but reappear at the moment you really need them.

- Irish screamer guide who is super picky about every detail, but still was fun and productive

Mellow and gregarious tarpon guide who was awesome with the push pole and at reading fish movement with the tides.

- Mellow and hard working OP steelhead guides with interesting stories in between hooked fish

- My older brother on the oars, LOL! Nothing can please him.

My Dad who was not a patient teacher, but took us fly fishing every week one or two days from an early age.

 

[flybill]

I’ve fished with many guides over the years, some good, some mediocre, some bad…and a few exceptional ones. I suspect you are of the last type…

He is.. and I've never had him "guide" me..

 

[JS]

I hate it when people say do what you love for work. I call BS on that. Do what is OK for work but keep what you love a hobby so you continue to love it. There is not faster way to ruin what you love than to try and make a living at it.

I second that! Guiding was great when it was great, and the worst when it was bad. I don’t miss it.

 

[ifsteve]

There are far too many guides today. Been a big uptick the last 10 years or so. Every wanna be IGer and Team Bro Staffer thinks they are guides. Part of the problem is that in most places there isn't even much of any kind of testing or criteria to be a guide. Pay your fee to the State and there you go you are now a guide. The guides who actually KNOW their fishery and have the right gear and are the right mental makeup are worth their weight in gold. The problem is that they are a pretty small subset of the "guide" pool at large anymore.

 

[JudyM]

I know in Oregon, to be a guide you have to take a six-pack course from the Coast Guard which was not cheap. Also have to take a Red Cross course on CPR and qualify for it. On top of that, the insurance. Dealing with different personalities, no problem. During my career, I ran an aduIt daycare sales center of 200. I thought about becoming one, but I am not an early bird, so passed on it.

 

[Salmo_g]

There are far too many guides today.

I agree that it seems like it. However, if there were too many for market conditions, wouldn't guide fees drop? My observation is that guide fees have risen more than CPI inflation over the last 15 years. Or maybe your metric for ". . . too many . . ." is something other than supply and demand.