Endangered Squirrels

[wanderingrichard]

Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife seeks comment on status review for western gray squirrel

OLYMPIA – The Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW) is seeking public input on a draft periodic status review for western gray squirrel that includes a recommendation to re-classify

www.bigcountrynewsconnection.com

 

[Rob Allen]

Make a doable plan to restore their population before you list them... listing without a plan and a goal is pointless.

Also before public opinion can be collected we need to know every possible impact on human beings. If it requires ANY restrictions on human behavior beyond actually harvesting the squirrels I automatically oppose it.

 

[Scott Salzer]

I have actually seen one a few years back. Pretty critters.

 

[Zak]

If it requires ANY restrictions on human behavior beyond actually harvesting the squirrels I automatically oppose it.

Not a fan of any other ESA listings, then?

 

[TicTokCroc]

Time to start killing more red fox squirrels.

 

[RCF]

What about the Eastern Grey Squirrels? They are endargering our Douglas squirrels?⁷

 

[Rio Grande King]

While working on a forest fire I once got to see a Mount Graham red squirrel, Tamiasciurus fremonti grahamensis. Following the devastating Frye Fire their population is today estimated to be just 156 individuals.

Habitat loss is the primary factor pinching the squirrels but in one of nature’s cruel jokes they are considered tasty snacks by a different much more common but threatened species, the Mexican spotted owl, Strix occidentalis lucida.

 

[Rob Allen]

Not a fan of any other ESA listings, then?

The only time it's done any good that I am aware of is with the Bald Eagle. At that time we knew exactly what the problem was and we had a plan for their restoration.
We knew young Eagles were not surviving because their shells were too thin because of ddt. We axed ddt and the eagles came back.
Conversely take our beloved steelhead, they became listed, we've spent billions developing plans and studying and fixing habitat. People have changed all kinds of behaviors some against their will and what do we have to show for it? Very little to nothing.
If they know the problem and can fix the problem for the squirrels by all means just do it, why the need for listing? If it's just another quagmire like so many other species what's the point? It won't do the squirrels any good.

 

[Buzzy]

I wonder if the "gray" squirrels that our cat hunted and killed (and ate parts of) were eastern gray squirrels (Port Orchard). At any rate, I had an abundant supply of "gray" squirrel tail back then. Here in the Basin, fox squirrels are very common and be quite troubling for utility companies.

 

[jasmillo]

The only time it's done any good that I am aware of is with the Bald Eagle. At that time we knew exactly what the problem was and we had a plan for their restoration.
We knew young Eagles were not surviving because their shells were too thin because of ddt. We axed ddt and the eagles came back.
Conversely take our beloved steelhead, they became listed, we've spent billions developing plans and studying and fixing habitat. People have changed all kinds of behaviors some against their will and what do we have to show for it? Very little to nothing.
If they know the problem and can fix the problem for the squirrels by all means just do it, why the need for listing? If it's just another quagmire like so many other species what's the point? It won't do the squirrels any good.

There are actually a ton of success stories linked ESA listings. The big, obvious ones like the Bald Eagle, Grizzly Bears, Grey Wolves, American Alligators, multiple pinniped populations, etc. and a lot of less obvious ones. Unless you are defining success as something different than population rebound.

 

[Stonedfish]

WDFW can fund research and habitat restoration with a new western gray squirrel watching pass.
SF

 

[jasmillo]

WDFW can fund research and habitat restoration with a new western gray squirrel watching pass.
SF

If anyone wants to come watch the fattest Eastern Grey Squirels in Washington, I only charge 25 dollars per viewing session. Book quick though, the local neighborhood owls are probably going to make this opportunity obsolete before too long…

 

[Scott Salzer]

We used to have flying squirrels. Unfortunately, we also had cats, and they really liked them.....

 

[Long_Rod_Silvers]

The only time it's done any good that I am aware of is with the Bald Eagle. At that time we knew exactly what the problem was and we had a plan for their restoration.
We knew young Eagles were not surviving because their shells were too thin because of ddt. We axed ddt and the eagles came back.
Conversely take our beloved steelhead, they became listed, we've spent billions developing plans and studying and fixing habitat. People have changed all kinds of behaviors some against their will and what do we have to show for it? Very little to nothing.
If they know the problem and can fix the problem for the squirrels by all means just do it, why the need for listing? If it's just another quagmire like so many other species what's the point? It won't do the squirrels any good.

I think - and I hope someone corrects me if I'm wrong - that the ESA listing provides the legal framework for agencies to 'fix' whatever it is the problem is identified to be.

I get your point though (if you know the problem fix it). I think unfortunately implimenting solutions is probably not that simple when done in the context of wildlife and people jobs and properties and lives are affected. Hence the need of the ESA to provide some legal framework.

Please someone correct me if I'm wrong on this.

 

[Rob Allen]

There are actually a ton of success stories linked ESA listings. The big, obvious ones like the Bald Eagle, Grizzly Bears, Grey Wolves, American Alligators, multiple pinniped populations, etc. and a lot of less obvious ones. Unless you are defining success as something different than population rebound.

Grey wolves were simply planted, alligators harvest was managed, same with marine mammals. Not sure about Grizzlies .
Funny thing that the restoration of those animals have to one extent or another caused other problems.
You're correct however about other successes.

 

[jasmillo]

Grey wolves were simply planted, alligators harvest was managed, same with marine mammals. Not sure about Grizzlies .
Funny thing that the restoration of those animals have to one extent or another caused other problems.
You're correct however about other successes.

That stuff happened because of their ESA listings though. Regardless of the reason for their listing, getting listed is what I’m the end provided the protection to them, their environments, etc. that has led them to in many cases get delisted.

As far as the other “problems” you cite; that has nothing to with the success of the ESA. I’d say some of the other problems caused were the reason many animals are listed in the first place. So, is it resurrecting an old “problem”…or a success. I guess it depends on how you look at it.

 

[Dustin Chromers]

Grey wolves were simply planted, alligators harvest was managed, same with marine mammals. Not sure about Grizzlies .
Funny thing that the restoration of those animals have to one extent or another caused other problems.
You're correct however about other successes.

I'd be interested in planting some alligators in the soap lake area and beyond. I'm going to propose this at the next WDFW public input session. I don't think it's any more outlandish than many of the current policies and practices. A guy can dream. I would love to hunt alligators in the Washington scab lands.

 

[Rob Allen]

That stuff happened because of their ESA listings though. Regardless of the reason for their listing, getting listed is what I’m the end provided the protection to them, their environments, etc. that has led them to in many cases get delisted.

As far as the other “problems” you cite; that has nothing to with the success of the ESA. I’d say some of the other problems caused were the reason many animals are listed in the first place. So, is it resurrecting an old “problem”…or a success. I guess it depends on how you look at it.

Well If for example the squirrel got listed and as a result of the listing private timber companies were told they can't log their own land, then I'd oppose it even if it meant bye bye Grey squirrels..
I hate logging, always have but there is something I hate more and is much more prevalent and dangerous. Government control of private property.

 

[Buzzy]

That stuff happened because of their ESA listings though. Regardless of the reason for their listing, getting listed is what I’m the end provided the protection to them, their environments, etc. that has led them to in many cases get delisted.

As far as the other “problems” you cite; that has nothing to with the success of the ESA. I’d say some of the other problems caused were the reason many animals are listed in the first place. So, is it resurrecting an old “problem”…or a success. I guess it depends on how you look at it.

With regards to the Methow, Okanagan, Wenatchee and ESA listed steelhead - it's the delisting part that I don't think will happen anytime soon. Ocean conditions, warming river waters, population growth, habitat changes, dams, and so on don't bode well for strong runs of wild steelhead in "my" local rivers anytime soon.

 

[jasmillo]

Well If for example the squirrel got listed and as a result of the listing private timber companies were told they can't log their own land, then I'd oppose it even if it meant bye bye Grey squirrels..
I hate logging, always have but there is something I hate more and is much more prevalent and dangerous. Government control of private property.

I am not arguing for or against the listing of this squirrel. As much as I hate to loose species, I’m a realist. Just saying when applied, the ESA has worked to increase populations in the majority of cases.