“ gun control “
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Zak
Legend
There is an interesting article in the Atlantic this week, titled THE NARCISSISM OF THE ANGRY YOUNG MEN. The point seems to be that we need a way to identify and help or or intercept what the author calls "The Lost Boys." Here are some quotes from the paywalled article:
They are man-boys who maintain a teenager’s sharp sense of self-absorbed grievance long after adolescence; they exhibit a combination of childish insecurity and lethally bold arrogance; they are sexually and socially insecure. Perhaps most dangerous, they go almost unnoticed until they explode. Some of them open fire on their schools or other institutions; others become Islamic radicals; yet others embrace right-wing-extremist conspiracies.
These attacks are not merely “violence” in some general sense, nor are they similar to other gun crimes classified as “mass shootings” beyond the number of victims. Drug-war shoot-outs and gang vendettas are awful, but they are better-understood problems, in both their origins and possible remedies. The Lost Boys, however, are the perpetrators of out-of-the-blue massacres of innocents. Their actions are not driven by criminal gain, but instead are meant to shock us, to make us grieve, and finally, to force us to acknowledge the miserable existence of the young men behind the triggers.
After each Lost Boy killing, Americans are engulfed in grief and anger, but eventually, we are overtaken by a sense of helplessness. Sometimes, we respond by raging at one another; we fight about gun control or mental-health funding or the role of social media as we try to fix blame and reduce a seemingly inexplicable act to something discrete and solvable. But I wonder now, as I did back in 2015, if all of these debates are focusing on the wrong problems. Yes, the country is awash in guns; yes, depression seems to be on the rise in young people; yes, extremists are using social media to fuse together atomized losers into explosive compounds. But the raw material for all of the violence is mostly a stream of lost young men.
Why is this happening? What are we missing? Guns and anomie and extremism are only facets of the problem. The real malady afflicting these men, one about which I’ve written much in the intervening years since that original article, is the deluge of narcissism in the modern world, especially among failed-to-launch young men whose injured grandiosity leads them to blame others for their own shortcomings and insecurities—and to seek revenge.
The lost boys are mostly young and male, largely middle- or working-class. Frustrated by their own social awkwardness, they are so often described as “loners” that the trope has been around from as early as the 1980s. But these young males, no matter how “quiet,” are filled with an astonishing level of enraged resentment and entitlement about their roles as men, and they seek rationalizations for inflicting violence on a society they think has both ignored and injured them. They become what the German writer Hans Magnus Enzensberger called “radical losers,” unsuccessful men who feel that they have been denied their dominant role in society and who then channel their blunted male social impulses toward destruction.
What we can do, however, is start talking more about the specific problem of dangerous male immaturity without falling into endless loops about gun control, public health, or “toxic masculinity.” We can, in schools and colleges, pay closer attention to the boys and young men who seem to be sliding toward darkness, perhaps with more attempts to pull them toward a community or into mentorship with older men. At the least, we should be able to find a way to engage in gentle interventions early rather than face more drastic consequences later. As Enzensberger presciently warned nearly two decades ago: “It is difficult to talk about the loser, and it is stupid not to.”
They are man-boys who maintain a teenager’s sharp sense of self-absorbed grievance long after adolescence; they exhibit a combination of childish insecurity and lethally bold arrogance; they are sexually and socially insecure. Perhaps most dangerous, they go almost unnoticed until they explode. Some of them open fire on their schools or other institutions; others become Islamic radicals; yet others embrace right-wing-extremist conspiracies.
These attacks are not merely “violence” in some general sense, nor are they similar to other gun crimes classified as “mass shootings” beyond the number of victims. Drug-war shoot-outs and gang vendettas are awful, but they are better-understood problems, in both their origins and possible remedies. The Lost Boys, however, are the perpetrators of out-of-the-blue massacres of innocents. Their actions are not driven by criminal gain, but instead are meant to shock us, to make us grieve, and finally, to force us to acknowledge the miserable existence of the young men behind the triggers.
After each Lost Boy killing, Americans are engulfed in grief and anger, but eventually, we are overtaken by a sense of helplessness. Sometimes, we respond by raging at one another; we fight about gun control or mental-health funding or the role of social media as we try to fix blame and reduce a seemingly inexplicable act to something discrete and solvable. But I wonder now, as I did back in 2015, if all of these debates are focusing on the wrong problems. Yes, the country is awash in guns; yes, depression seems to be on the rise in young people; yes, extremists are using social media to fuse together atomized losers into explosive compounds. But the raw material for all of the violence is mostly a stream of lost young men.
Why is this happening? What are we missing? Guns and anomie and extremism are only facets of the problem. The real malady afflicting these men, one about which I’ve written much in the intervening years since that original article, is the deluge of narcissism in the modern world, especially among failed-to-launch young men whose injured grandiosity leads them to blame others for their own shortcomings and insecurities—and to seek revenge.
The lost boys are mostly young and male, largely middle- or working-class. Frustrated by their own social awkwardness, they are so often described as “loners” that the trope has been around from as early as the 1980s. But these young males, no matter how “quiet,” are filled with an astonishing level of enraged resentment and entitlement about their roles as men, and they seek rationalizations for inflicting violence on a society they think has both ignored and injured them. They become what the German writer Hans Magnus Enzensberger called “radical losers,” unsuccessful men who feel that they have been denied their dominant role in society and who then channel their blunted male social impulses toward destruction.
What we can do, however, is start talking more about the specific problem of dangerous male immaturity without falling into endless loops about gun control, public health, or “toxic masculinity.” We can, in schools and colleges, pay closer attention to the boys and young men who seem to be sliding toward darkness, perhaps with more attempts to pull them toward a community or into mentorship with older men. At the least, we should be able to find a way to engage in gentle interventions early rather than face more drastic consequences later. As Enzensberger presciently warned nearly two decades ago: “It is difficult to talk about the loser, and it is stupid not to.”
TicTokCroc
Sunkist and Sudafed
I would agree that young men, more so young white men have been abandoned by our institutions. Trying to overcompensate for past wrongs has led the pendulum to swing way too far the other way instead of just providing equal opportunity for all. Gotta take an Atlantic article with a healthy dose of salt grain though. I got out just in time I think, early 2000s. I remember my senior year in HS I refused to do an assignment in English class because I thought it was a bullshit waste of time. It was... write scholarship essays. I got in an argument with the instructor over how useless it was for me to do the assignment. As a young white man from a lower middle class family that was only mediocre at sports I knew I didn't have a chance. I knew this at 17. My wife got a scholarship, she's a POC and had similar grades as I did.
Zak
Legend
Huh, we took different things away from that article.
TicTokCroc
Sunkist and Sudafed
Zak
Legend
Just guessing here, but I think it is largly isolation, media bombardment with a style of life unattainable for them (and most people), and lack of impulse control. Stoicism and self-reflection has been replaced by resentment and festering grievances. "My life sucks and you all are going to pay!"
I'll field that one. They are lashing out because they are weak, lack purpose, a father figure, and in general are lazy losers that feel way more grand about themselves than reality as a defense mechanism against actually facing and dealing with insecurity. Most have an interiority complex they mask by using undue bravado to atone for unearned manhood by attempting to imitate their trailer park version of Dan Bilzarian made so popular in the isolated screen life they choose to live. They are socially stunted because they have no male mentors and still tremble at the thought of talking to an actual attractive woman their age instead of just watching porn, cause it's easy. The real commonality I find with "men" of this type and addicts is a complete and total lack of anything resembling accountability. This is societal and ironically the battle cry of the very folks they say they oppose. Lasty but not least is the lack of male fellowship leads them to gangs and now more recently social media hangouts where like minded losers hang out and be real hip and edgy together. These guys used to join a motorcycle gang and act all tough in a group. But now they are so pathetic they join stormfront or some other bullshit deal where they talk all big and live in their mom's basement who cook and clean for them. Young men are in a sorry state these days. Their father's in many cases were just as apathetic and useless as them. I only hope this new generation of super loser is so entrenched in porn that they will never reproduce thus stopping the cycle.
Here are some tips on being your father's father's version of being a man.
Be honest even when it hurts.
Work hard even if it isn't easy.
Take risks even if it's scary.
Remember true power lies not in the beating you can give someone but the mercy you show even when they deserve it.
Never hit a woman, period.
Let your actions speak louder than your voice.
Build something. Be it a structure, a home, a business. Build anything that you can call your own.
Treat weaker people kindly.
Defend someone against a bully even if that bully is someone you call a friend.
Try hard, even if you know you will likely be beaten by someone better.
Always play and work with those better than you.
Be graceful in victory and defeat.
Respect yourself.
Don't demand respect, earn it.
Trust. It's a dying thing but trust until proven otherwise.
Take public credit for your failures and quietly revel in your successes.
Teach someone something worthwhile.
Watch what you say to your parents and your lady partner. Words can never be taken back and a woman that loves you as well as parents have a memory that defies time and words have the power to hurt them and your relationship with them permanently.
Be nice to everyone including your potential enemies.
Be humble but competent.
Don't talk ill of yourself even to yourself. Your body and mind doesn't know the difference.
Be the person you aspire to be even if it hurts and costs you something dear.
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TicTokCroc
Sunkist and Sudafed
Porn. Seeing what they can't have.
Cultural decay being driven by a narrative on various screens motivating otherwise lazy individuals to action. You know. Useful idiots.
Basically the same shit motivating young males to join up with moron groups to "be heard". Same shit different channel.
wanderingrichard
Life of the Party
@Salmo_g
Wouldn't the mental health waiver constitute a violation of HIPAA ??
While assisting my late sister with getting her affairs in order, we couldn't even discuss her medical issues with my wife in the room because Hospital staff would invoke HIPAA at the slightest breath of disclosure.
So, how would this requirement in 1143 not violate it too ?
wanderingrichard
Life of the Party
RobI disagree. We already have powerful gun laws and they do absolutely nothing..
The ATF just came out with new laws, which is a problem all by itself, about making stabilizing braces for hand guns illegal after decades of saying they are perfectly legal.
There is no data whatsoever that I can find where stabilizing braces are used in crime.
These illegal laws are created by a political organization to punish people who they see as political adversaries. There is literally no other reason for this law than to create felons out of law abiding citizens. In my mind that makes the government the criminal.
If this were any other ammendment this debate would not exist. Some people just think that the 2nd is a second class ammendment. If we can protect damaging trash like hustler magazine with the first ammendment we can protect much less damaging AR-15s with standard 30 round magazines with the 2nd.
As Daniel Ocean pointed out arguing about this will not change a thing..
What I really want is a high powered bb gun so I can sit up on the canyon walls of the Deschutes and plink indicators all day..
www.pyramidair.com
Rob Allen
Life of the Party
The bill of rights was absolutely never to be taken away from. Those are SOME of the God given rights that government is forbidden to touch.. yes absolutely forbidden regardless I'd circumstances or the will of the majority..
If an AR is not protected by the second ammendment then your tweets and emails are not protected by the first..
As far as a tyrannical American government? We're already not that far off. Or do you not recent government actions that kept you locked up at home?
If an AR is not protected by the second ammendment then your tweets and emails are not protected by the first..
As far as a tyrannical American government? We're already not that far off. Or do you not recent government actions that kept you locked up at home?
This is easily the most comprehensive, to the bone explanation of this cultural dysfunction I have ever read. Thank you for bringing this to the forum.
The solutions, however. are MIA.
We are living in a society in whch the family has been fragmented apart. The US has the highest rate in the world of single parent families, 86% of single parents are women, and over half of single mothers have never been married or co-habitated, so their offspring has never had a male role model much less a co-parenting model.
Another critical driver is social shaming, which has exploded along with the overwhelming growth of social media, and is tagged by psychologists as the primary driver for a suicide rate that has double among adolescents and young adults in the past decade
And the number one cause of death for children in the US?
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God never granted the Bill of Rights, wrote the Bill of Rights, blessed the Bill of Rights, or ordained the right to bear arms, it was written by commen men of whom 17 of the 55 delegates to the Constitutional Convention owned a total of about 1,400 slaves.
So the same men who wrote the second amendment were also the same men who were either slaveholders, or were tolerent of slavery which was legal at the time.
As to forbidden? That is determined by the majority of the people, which is the underlying foundation of democracy.
Zak
Legend
Note that in my post I only pasted a few paragraphs from a longer piece. Full article is here (there might be way to read it without subscribing to the Atlantic, but I'm a subscriber so I don't know):This is easily the most comprehensive, to the bone explanation of this cultural dysfunction I have ever read. Thank you for bringing this to the forum.
The solutions, however. are MIA.
We are living in a society in whch the family has been fragmented apart. The US has the highest rate in the world of single parent families, 86% of single parents are women, and over half of single mothers have never been married or co-habitated, so thwhich has just explored with their offspring has never had a male role model much less a co-parenting model.
Another critical driver is social shaming, which has exploded along with the overwhelming growth of social media, and is tagged by psychologists as the primary driver for a suicide rate that has doulbe among adolescents and young adults in the past decade
And the number one cause of death for children in the US?
The Narcissism of the Angry Young Men
What to do about the deadly misfits among us? First, recognize the problem.
www.theatlantic.com
wanderingrichard
Life of the Party
No, bill, its not an interpretation. It was written so that the greater population would have parity of arms with the "government" if it became necessary to overthrow a tyrannical government by force of arms.
Each of our guaranteed rights within the bill of rights and the body of text that is our constitution are inter linked. Remove or weaken one, and you lose others in the process.
Regarding "militia" : that's a deep dive i think anyone interested in the term should take the time to make.
Looking at the Militia Act of 1903, it pans out as a way for the federal government to consolidate military power away from the states, several of which had very powerful state militias and "State Guard" units, prior to the National Guard Act, which came later.
If you do do that dive, beware you'll need a score card and a Ouija Board at times to make sense of it all.
Last year in Canada two brothers stabbed 10 or so people to death on a reserve if I remember correctly.
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