Perfection loop knot

I didn't even know what a perfection loop was until I started to fly fish 10 years ago...bimini's were standard for trolling (and crimping loops with chafe tube) and if the leader was significantly stronger than the main line, triple surgeons knot...palomar and improved clinch knot to terminal gear. Occasional a homer rhodes loop knot for jigs (again, if the leader was significantly stronger than the main line...

I had to learn a whole new slew of knots to tie on flies we never used in HI salt big game, bottom fishing or surf casting...
 
Wayne Kohan said:
my 5 foot leader of 10# Maxima was missing entirely.
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Wayne, I think this is/was your problem. A perfection loop knot is classified as having 60% of line strength. Your non-slip loop knot probably has between 90 and 100% of line strength. Perfection loop knots are perfectly fine when your leader butt section is much higher test line strength than your tippet. Never use a Perfection loop knot when your leader is a single piece of nylon which is all the same strength.
 
Salmo_g said:
Wayne, I think this is/was your problem. A perfection loop knot is classified as having 60% of line strength. Your non-slip loop knot probably has between 90 and 100% of line strength. Perfection loop knots are perfectly fine when your leader butt section is much higher test line strength than your tippet. Never use a Perfection loop knot when your leader is a single piece of nylon which is all the same strength.
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Never had it put this way. Super helpful.
 
Brute said:
I didn't even know what a perfection loop was until I started to fly fish 10 years ago...bimini's were standard for trolling (and crimping loops with chafe tube) and if the leader was significantly stronger than the main line, triple surgeons knot...palomar and improved clinch knot to terminal gear. Occasional a homer rhodes loop knot for jigs (again, if the leader was significantly stronger than the main line...

I had to learn a whole new slew of knots to tie on flies we never used in HI salt big game, bottom fishing or surf casting...
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Yeah... I thought I knew enough knots until I started fishing saltwater. Toothy critters require stout leaders, so you usually have to double your mainline into a Bimini loop or some such to bring your mainline up to the strength of your leader. I'm "not very good" at tying those knots. Whole new level of patience and steadiness required.
 
Shad said:
Yeah... I thought I knew enough knots until I started fishing saltwater. Toothy critters require stout leaders, so you usually have to double your mainline into a Bimini loop or some such to bring your mainline up to the strength of your leader. I'm "not very good" at tying those knots. Whole new level of patience and steadiness required.
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And knees…who knew you had to include both knees in tying a knot…
 
When I use a non-tapered leader that does not require the delicacy of fishing a small dry for trout, say swinging for steelhead or salmon, I will tie a perfection loop on both ends of a 30 or 40 lb butt section of appropriate length. The tippet then has a loop tied in it with a spider hitch and that loop doubled with a double surgeon forming a two strand loop to handshake with the butt section. The fly is then tied on with a non-slip loop knot or, better, a Steve Huff loop knot. If there is breakage it will occur at the fly unless the leader is abraded like by a rock or coral. Steelhead or salmon fishing I will carry several tippets already tied with the spider hitch loop should the original have to be replaced so it takes no time or knot tying to change tippets and the butt section is never shortened when doing so. Easy peasy and the weakest link is at the fly. This has also been my goto for bonefish and permit when a bite tippet is not necessary.
 
Salmo_g said:
Wayne, I think this is/was your problem. A perfection loop knot is classified as having 60% of line strength. Your non-slip loop knot probably has between 90 and 100% of line strength. Perfection loop knots are perfectly fine when your leader butt section is much higher test line strength than your tippet. Never use a Perfection loop knot when your leader is a single piece of nylon which is all the same strength.
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Yep, that makes great sense and well explained. I hadn't thought about it like this before. And as Eastside stated earlier, 10 pound test is not the leader for a big salmon. I'm not really fishing for salmon, I do catch an occasional coho, but they are the same size as the steelhead I'm fishing for, this fish was much bigger. But if the perfection loop is only 60%, I really shouldn't use it on my leaders unless they are tapered. Thanks!
 
mcswny said:
A. I'm totally joking.
B. I NEED to know what ______, ______, and ______ is.
C. Ironically, my kid asked me what are all the types of fish I caught this year were.
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B. Multiple tarpon (one the guide said was pushing 180), a few California halibut, and a handful of 12+ lb bonefish (Maui ftw).
 
Jake Watrous said:
In my experience every knot fails—usually due to tying/tightening/tag problems. Not a question of if but when. To prove a point…to myself I guess…everything I landed this year has been with a perfection loop as a line-leader connection and a non-slip loop knot as a leader/tippet to fly knot.

Including:

29 albacore
2.75 catch cards of salmon
100+ src
9 steelhead
100+ trouts
A bunch of other things like flounders, sculpins, carp, panfish
1 lemon shark

Edit: Trouts and SRC numbers are estimates because the spreadsheet simply has a 1 on days if I landed one or more, and a 0 if I landed none.
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Jake Watrous said:
B. Multiple tarpon (one the guide said was pushing 180), a few California halibut, and a handful of 12+ lb bonefish (Maui ftw).
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Holy Smokes...and I thought I had a decent year...
 
mcswny said:
WTF, where's the report!?
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I haven’t written a report, or really any reports…ever. I could say it’s because I lack the mental capacity at the moment (up at 3am every morning, home at 5:30, kids in taekwondo and soccer teams and music lessons, in bed at 10) but really it’s because whenever I sit down to do so I get self-conscious about talking about myself and overly critical about my writing and give up.
 
Brute said:
Holy Smokes...and I thought I had a decent year...
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I’m sure you did. You seem to get after it in ways I envy.

This year was out of the ordinary for me and unlikely to be repeated. A friend got married on Maui (hence the bonefish), another friend retired and moved to Belize (tarpon), and the California surf halibut because I really couldn’t take any more time at Legoland.
 
Jake Watrous said:
I haven’t written a report, or really any reports…ever. I could say it’s because I lack the mental capacity at the moment (up at 3am every morning, home at 5:30, kids in taekwondo and soccer teams and music lessons, in bed at 10) but really it’s because whenever I sit down to do so I get self-conscious about talking about myself and overly critical about my writing and give up.
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The first part I get, that's a rough schedule.

Second part, get over it and GIVE THE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT!
 
I do use the perfection loop when tying with 80+ lb mono and have never had any issues. I just don't have any confidence in it with lighter line.

Still, my biggest issue with using the perfection loop is that I can tie a non slip loop just as easily, and nearly as quickly, so I just don't really see the point of using it. There are some scenarios where I will knowingly use an inferior knot just because it's so much easier to tie in the heat of the moment, but the perfection loop is just just that much faster to tie that I've ever felt I needed to use one in place of a non slip.
 
Is there any reason I should not keep using a figure 8 for loops? It's super easy and fast to tie, and it's good enough for climbers.
 
Interesting thread. I've never had issues with a perfection loop, but it's almost always in 25# or greater butt sections of tapered leaders. The exception is for short flat sections of 12-15# ultra-green looped onto a sink tip. But even there I tend to put in a larger diameter line at the butt just to keep it from cutting into the loop on the tip .
 
Like others have stated, I trust and use the perfection loop on 20# or bigger stuff. And when I started fishing for musky using 80 or 100# fluoro for bite tippet I also used a perfection loop at the fly. It's a smaller, neater knot than the non-slip loop so very helpful for that application.

When steelheading with 10 or 12# Max it's always just a blood knot to the commercial tapered leader or to my own tapered leader. And if my own, it's a perfection loop to the fly line or head if it still has a loop. Nail knot if no fly line or head loop.

And I'm still a double turle knot guy if the fly has an up-turned eye. If not, it's a non-slip loop.
 
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