Buena Luz Bakery
www.buenaluzbakery.com
First raft trip
- Thread starter jact55
- Start date
www.buenaluzbakery.com
The guys have given great advice, like usual. One thing that others have hit on is river level (cfs) and to watch those. There is an abundance of information out there these days, but it can be tough to discern whether the flows are best for beginners or advanced and whether we're talking about crazy kayakers (I mean that as a compliment) or fishermen/women that happen to be also be floaters.
A lot of whitewater sites have great access and flow info, but it's usually at the flows they like to have fun. So look for fishing centric places like fly shops or outfitters that list the best conditions for fisher people floating, not 16' whitewater raft people.
Also, be sure to take notes when you do finally float! This is so helpful for future trips and even possible comparisons to other rivers. Note things like "400 cfs best for floating, but 300 is fine, just will have some walking the boat." Or "X launch down to Y takeout is an all day float at 429 cfs. Was pretty skinny and had to walk thru 3 rapids. Barely had time to fish."
This will help you avoid times of flood, but just as important, times of low water. Higher CFS, the faster you're going to move down the river. What might be an all day float at 2000 cfs is only 4 hours in 5000 cfs. Or, you may get stuck in the dark at 1000 cfs. And things like upstream wind. Some of my worst "timings" have been calm rivers that were low and then got an upstream wind. For example, the John Day or Yakima canyon. Rowing downstream against the wind is not fun, but more importantly, it slows you way down so getting to the take out could be an issue.
And use sites like this for flows- https://waterdata.usgs.gov/wa/nwis/current/?type=flow
And then change to the Legacy page-
And look for these-
So very easy to see that the Sky is 50% of it's usual flow. Maybe flowing at 1500 is great for floating, but crappy for fishing. Or vice versa.
Good luck and have fun learning. And nice boat!!
A lot of whitewater sites have great access and flow info, but it's usually at the flows they like to have fun. So look for fishing centric places like fly shops or outfitters that list the best conditions for fisher people floating, not 16' whitewater raft people.
Also, be sure to take notes when you do finally float! This is so helpful for future trips and even possible comparisons to other rivers. Note things like "400 cfs best for floating, but 300 is fine, just will have some walking the boat." Or "X launch down to Y takeout is an all day float at 429 cfs. Was pretty skinny and had to walk thru 3 rapids. Barely had time to fish."
This will help you avoid times of flood, but just as important, times of low water. Higher CFS, the faster you're going to move down the river. What might be an all day float at 2000 cfs is only 4 hours in 5000 cfs. Or, you may get stuck in the dark at 1000 cfs. And things like upstream wind. Some of my worst "timings" have been calm rivers that were low and then got an upstream wind. For example, the John Day or Yakima canyon. Rowing downstream against the wind is not fun, but more importantly, it slows you way down so getting to the take out could be an issue.
And use sites like this for flows- https://waterdata.usgs.gov/wa/nwis/current/?type=flow
And then change to the Legacy page-
And look for these-
So very easy to see that the Sky is 50% of it's usual flow. Maybe flowing at 1500 is great for floating, but crappy for fishing. Or vice versa.
Good luck and have fun learning. And nice boat!!
jact55
Life of the Party
Thank you all once again.
Nice Life jackets- check, I got em.
I downloaded Onx hunt app, so I can mark waypoints. Mainly cause until I learn rivers, im scared I won't know where to take out haha. Be shitty to miss the take out.
And it'll allow me to look back at past trips and such also.
I'm a big note taker. Got alot of that started. It is overwhelming, but I think mostly cause it's abstract in my mind still. Once I get floats done. It'll all come together.
I'm going to take the rowing class at reds flyshop in Ellensburg.
While I can't argue that week long class is better, the cost and more so the time is hard to spare.
I need my local lake to thaw so I can practice myself first. But hoping to have that class done by early June so i can start hitting rivers in summer. (April and May is screwed, work is moving facilities no time to spare).
Can't wait to launch into rocky ford!!!
(That's a joke)
Nice Life jackets- check, I got em.
I downloaded Onx hunt app, so I can mark waypoints. Mainly cause until I learn rivers, im scared I won't know where to take out haha. Be shitty to miss the take out.
And it'll allow me to look back at past trips and such also.
I'm a big note taker. Got alot of that started. It is overwhelming, but I think mostly cause it's abstract in my mind still. Once I get floats done. It'll all come together.
I'm going to take the rowing class at reds flyshop in Ellensburg.
While I can't argue that week long class is better, the cost and more so the time is hard to spare.
I need my local lake to thaw so I can practice myself first. But hoping to have that class done by early June so i can start hitting rivers in summer. (April and May is screwed, work is moving facilities no time to spare).
Can't wait to launch into rocky ford!!!
(That's a joke)
jact55
Life of the Party
I guess I have a question on oars.
Last night I was going to order my spare oar to strap to the raft.
The raft came with KBO 7.5 cataract oars.
Figured easy enough to get that exact oar.
Can't find em. Anywhere. Cataract website says backorder of 2 months.
....I know how this plays out. I don't get my oar for a long time lol. Summer comes and I'm still without.
And 250 bucks a oar, I'm not trying to pay them and then scramble to find another one quickly later.
Any other good brands of oars that make Oars for small boats?
NRS website has some options, but I'm starting to think small boat oars, at least ones that match the exact model on my raft are tough to find.
Length, diameter, ect hard to find a perfect match.
Worst case, should I settle for a spare that's slightly different length wise? Sound dumb to me.
Last night I was going to order my spare oar to strap to the raft.
The raft came with KBO 7.5 cataract oars.
Figured easy enough to get that exact oar.
Can't find em. Anywhere. Cataract website says backorder of 2 months.
....I know how this plays out. I don't get my oar for a long time lol. Summer comes and I'm still without.
And 250 bucks a oar, I'm not trying to pay them and then scramble to find another one quickly later.
Any other good brands of oars that make Oars for small boats?
NRS website has some options, but I'm starting to think small boat oars, at least ones that match the exact model on my raft are tough to find.
Length, diameter, ect hard to find a perfect match.
Worst case, should I settle for a spare that's slightly different length wise? Sound dumb to me.
Your spare oar is kinda like your spare donut tire. It’s a “just in case”. Anything to get you to the car. If you’re on a multi day, hard trip maybe you’ll want to more closely match your oar but otherwise something close will work. I’ve only lost one oar in and that was a big flip in big water. Never broken a oar. That’s not to say it won’t happen but it’s not something I worry about. I will strap on anything as a spare for a day trip.
7' 2-Piece Oar - Outcast Boats
The 7' 2-piece Outcast oars break down for easy transport and storage.
www.outcastboats.com
jact55
Life of the Party
Thank you. I like that price alot better.Your spare oar is kinda like your spare donut tire. It’s a “just in case”. Anything to get you to the car. If you’re on a multi day, hard trip maybe you’ll want to more closely match your oar but otherwise something close will work. I’ve only lost one oar in and that was a big flip in big water. Never broken a oar. That’s not to say it won’t happen but it’s not something I worry about. I will strap on anything as a spare for a day trip.
7' 2-Piece Oar - Outcast Boats
The 7' 2-piece Outcast oars break down for easy transport and storage.
ThomasM
corvus ossifragus
Stopped by the bakery this morning on our way out. Picked up some pastries for breakfast and a house loaf to go with soup tonight. I think stopping there on the early morning drive to Beaver will be my new routine!Buena Luz Bakery
I told Emily she owed you the sale. LOL
The upper Spokane is handy to you, and is a pretty good first float. It offering a variety: a couple of small but not insignificant roller waves, some riffles, some shallow bars and deeper rocks, a usual upstream wind, some really nice frogwater for basking and having a beer on a nice afternoon, The best float is to put in at Corbin Park in Post Falls, and float down to Harvard Rd. bridge in Liberty Lake. The takeouts below there are not for first-timers. At Harvard Rd. the takeout is river right just after the bridge, and rowing a raft from the preferred channel to the takeout requires some gumption. So basically you're likely to get a bit of everything, just not too much of anything. It gets pretty low after they close in the Dam around the 4th of July.
Of course the river in WA is closed to fishing now. And while the flows in this stretch today are pretty favorable, it's colder than you'd want if you got wet. You're on the wrong side of breakup to get in a hurry. FYI The best gage to use for flows in this stretch is the one at Post Falls Dam, https://waterdata.usgs.gov/monitoring-location/12419000/. The river loses flow to the aquifer all through this stretch. I like this stretch 2000-6000 cfs. June's pretty ideal for a lotta reasons so it may fit your schedule.
The North Fork of the Cd'A is also a short trip away, and offers an early and not particulary intense breakup period, as well as dandy fishing. It's still winter up there. Best gage: https://waterdata.usgs.gov/id/nwis/dv/?site_no=12413000, and the most knowledgable guy I know on this in terms of flows year around is Bo at Silver Bow.
I guess I'd recommend spending less time driving and more time floating your first few trips.
As to spare oars, get one the same length. Otherwise, a used one is good, and use anything before you decide. I think 7 1/2 foot oars on your boat is pretty short...you may want extensions.
A pfd for you and your companion, a drybag full of spares (an oar lock, other boat related stuff), safety items (small first aid kit, whistle, etc.), a throwbag or two and some line and you're on the river, bro.
Of course the river in WA is closed to fishing now. And while the flows in this stretch today are pretty favorable, it's colder than you'd want if you got wet. You're on the wrong side of breakup to get in a hurry. FYI The best gage to use for flows in this stretch is the one at Post Falls Dam, https://waterdata.usgs.gov/monitoring-location/12419000/. The river loses flow to the aquifer all through this stretch. I like this stretch 2000-6000 cfs. June's pretty ideal for a lotta reasons so it may fit your schedule.
The North Fork of the Cd'A is also a short trip away, and offers an early and not particulary intense breakup period, as well as dandy fishing. It's still winter up there. Best gage: https://waterdata.usgs.gov/id/nwis/dv/?site_no=12413000, and the most knowledgable guy I know on this in terms of flows year around is Bo at Silver Bow.
I guess I'd recommend spending less time driving and more time floating your first few trips.
As to spare oars, get one the same length. Otherwise, a used one is good, and use anything before you decide. I think 7 1/2 foot oars on your boat is pretty short...you may want extensions.
A pfd for you and your companion, a drybag full of spares (an oar lock, other boat related stuff), safety items (small first aid kit, whistle, etc.), a throwbag or two and some line and you're on the river, bro.
jact55
Life of the Party
Thank you. Good info.
I never thought about post falls to Otis orchards. I'm very familiar with both of those places to put in and take out. Use to live off of Harvard. I've just been staring at riverside park thinking I'm not doing this stretch any time soon haha.
I'm in no hurry at all. Work will dominate my life April and May. Boat will be dry until then. I scheduled a private rowing lesson for June 15th with red fly shop in Ellensburg. Nice to get some learning done, but also see the Yakima river.
I'll practice on lakes until those lessons. Then jump in heavy.
I think I'll do the upper spokane for first trip. I like that.
But others I've been staring at for easier runs are the north fork cda, st Marie's, and Clark fork.
I'm in Missoula and Kalispell for work, do evenings on the flathead or kootenia will be a thing also.
I'm compiling all the gear.
I have a throwbag ordered, and multiple dry bags and such for gear and storage. Life vests I have and are mandatory. I've been eyeing extra oar locks.
Good call on first aid kit.
I take the safety seriously. Maybe to the point of phsycing myself out sometimes haha. Be laying in bed stressing lol.
I haven't ordered the extra oar yet. The 7' spare vs 7.5' is bugging me. Probably won't need it, but if I do, I'm going to have to order another oar anyways. So why not fork over the extra money to start. I'm thinking on that.
Noted on longer oars. I was looking at cataract ssg (think that's what they're called). Beefier and longer. Maybe eventually. But damn spendy.
I'll look into extentions also.
But until I start rowing I'm shooting blind here.
Again, thanks for your input. Good stuff.
Silverbow had been a good help. Just catching them at slow times, which lately they haven't been to crazy busy when I stop in. Theyve given me some maps and shuttle numbers that could be handy.
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jact55
Life of the Party
I remember when I was 18 or so, floating the cda river on an inner tube drunk as shit. If I remember right, it was Hella busy with party people.
Assuming if summer, early AM is the only time to float it, unless you are looking to drink with the masses and not fish.
Do you all agree?
Assuming if summer, early AM is the only time to float it, unless you are looking to drink with the masses and not fish.
Do you all agree?
jact55
Life of the Party
Set up my outdoor storage for this year.
Had to get the raft out of the garage so my wife can spray paint random crap lol.
Maybe by fall I'll have a lean too roof built, but for now it's gonna look something like this.
Treated the raft with 303 this morning.
Cinder blocks with 2x4s. I put duct tape over the top and then shrink wrapped over them, just to help with splinters and such. Eventually I think I'll wrap in foam or something.
Raft on top
Then the smudges and scrapes from the frame, before it even hit water was bugging me. Took foam and put around rub points. Is this OK? My main concern is where the back of the frame connects to the middle. Leaves a gap and maybe work itself loose.
Moth balls and dryer sheets. Mice burrowing is a real concern. Got plenty of em out here.
Should I add any damp rid also??
Car cover to protect UV. Then a tarp over it to keep dry and further protect from uv. And 4 straps to hopefully keep it on.
Thoughts/critiques? Things I did dumb? Overkill/Underhill?
Longer term, it'll be prettier.
Had to get the raft out of the garage so my wife can spray paint random crap lol.
Maybe by fall I'll have a lean too roof built, but for now it's gonna look something like this.
Treated the raft with 303 this morning.
Cinder blocks with 2x4s. I put duct tape over the top and then shrink wrapped over them, just to help with splinters and such. Eventually I think I'll wrap in foam or something.
Raft on top
Then the smudges and scrapes from the frame, before it even hit water was bugging me. Took foam and put around rub points. Is this OK? My main concern is where the back of the frame connects to the middle. Leaves a gap and maybe work itself loose.
Moth balls and dryer sheets. Mice burrowing is a real concern. Got plenty of em out here.
Should I add any damp rid also??
Car cover to protect UV. Then a tarp over it to keep dry and further protect from uv. And 4 straps to hopefully keep it on.
Thoughts/critiques? Things I did dumb? Overkill/Underhill?
Longer term, it'll be prettier.
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JayB
Life of the Party
Congrats on the new raft! Aside from what's already been said, the best advice I can give for learning how to navigate safely on rivers is to practice hard moves in easy situations so you can make them easily in hard situations.
Look for eddies and practice maneuvering your raft into and out of them. That includes eddies behind boulders and other features that create a break in the current in the center of the river as well as along the sides. E.g. you come around a corner on a stretch of river with a swift current, and the only break in the current is created by a couch-sized boulder on the right shore 2/3 of the way across the river. Now imagine that there's a river-wide strainer with 100% of the current funneling into it 100 yards downstream and you *have* to get the raft into the eddy behind the rock.
Ditto for "ferries" - pick an eddy that's adjacent to a stretch of strong current, and practice breaking out of the eddy and rowing across while losing as little distance downstream as possible, and even better - with the intention of navigating to a particular spot across the river. Same as above, pretend that this is a "must-make" ferry and that you need to cross as high as possible. There are often spots with a jet of current in the main channel ripping between eddies/slack-water on both sides of the river, and you can get lots of valuable practice by spending 5 minutes ping-ponging back and forth across the river.
Same for "lines" - when you come across a stretch of river with multiple safe lines, such as a mild boulder garden - stop at the top and scope out the lines. There's usually an obvious line, and one or more equally-safe alternate lines that you can take that require more adept navigation and more strenuous rowing. Map out a safe-but-challenging line in your head and see if you can maneuver your raft through it. E.g. "Eddy out behind the boulder on the left, ferry across the swift current in the middle, catch the eddy behind the rock, then cross the main channel into the slack water behind that root-ball..." If you're playing this game the right way, you'll blow the line that you've picked out around 1/3 of the time and learn something useful from each failure.
This sounds like it could be dangerous, but it's really not so long as you make sure to pick features that have no hazardous features downstream and a stretch of relatively calm water below to recover and re-orient in if you make a mistake. That, and of course start on relatively easy features and work your way up as your skills improve.
Obviously doing too much of this would interfere with fishing, but on just about every float there are stretches that don't fish well that offer opportunities to practice maneuvering your raft for a minute or two. Try to work a few of these drills into every trip and it'll make you a much better rower, and if you feel motivated, float a river that's closed and make that a "training" float where the point is to get as much practice as you can making "hard moves in easy water."
Every once in a while I've found myself in a non-imaginary situation where I need to execute a "must-make" move while floating a river, and I feel like incorporating this skill-building mindset into my floats has saved my bacon more than a few times over the years.
Cool!
Maybe consider decking over your right tube (see pic below, can use plywood instead of diamond plate)
It’s going to be hard to get in the raft from the left due to the rods. Decking on the frame is game changer. So easy to step on then step in. Now add a suspended floor and you can even used studded boots!
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jact55
Life of the Party
All good advice.
I live an 1/8 of a mile from a lake. If I get a day off on April and May, it'll be spent practicing on still water.
Got that class mid June that hopefully will teach me a little (and allow me to see the Yakima river). Then I will employ some of this advice. This year I'm less concerned with fishing and more about learning the raft, water and such. If i get an hour of fishing on the first handful of trips thats fine (i say this now lol). So want to put alot of time into these sort of practices.
I've rowed rafts and DBs thru some gnarly stuff and wasn't really sure why I was following this thread. And then the link to Buena Luz Bakery was added. That's a game changer for me! I plan to pick up a sammie and some pastries and coffee for my next day trip to the OP rivers. There used to be a bakery/sandwich shop on 101 in PA that closed down years ago and my friends and I still miss it. I'm guessing Thomas and I won't be the only PNW Flyfishers boosting business at the Buena Luz Bakery.Buena Luz Bakery
ThomasM
corvus ossifragus
LOL I‘ve been thinking about their house loaf all week. Dipped in good olive oil with some red wine was heaven. Apologies for the thread drift!I'm guessing Thomas and I won't be the only PNW Flyfishers boosting business at the Buena Luz Bakery.
Some really great advice in this thread. One thing I would add for flows is https://www.americanwhitewater.org/content/River/view/river-index. Has great run descriptions and ranges for reasonable flows. This is a great book also -https://www.rei.com/product/777396/mountaineers-books-paddling-washington.
NF CdA would be a great river to learn on.
I'm in Spokane and would be happy to float with you if we can sync up.
NF CdA would be a great river to learn on.
I'm in Spokane and would be happy to float with you if we can sync up.