Carp - The golden bonefish

[Anonymous member 148]

I'm saying this with ZERO judgement.
But it does seem a little like senseless killing?

Yes it is senseless killing, sometimes you gotta feed that blood lust. I've never done it before but I would not leave the carcasses at the river to rot. I plan on burying them in the garden. They are not native and harmful so that's a good justification, although one bowfisher probably won't make any difference in their population.

*I don't like when they shoot gar in the south, unless they are eating them.

 

[mcswny]

Yes it is senseless killing, sometimes you gotta feed that blood lust. I've never done it before but I would not leave the carcasses at the river to rot. I plan on burying them in the garden. They are not native and harmful so that's a good justification, although one bowfisher probably won't make any difference in their population.

*I don't like when they shoot gar in the south, unless they are eating them.

Fair. I still have no judgement. But yeah, just letting the carcasses rot on the banks seems shitty on many levels.

 

[Canuck from Kansas]

Fair. I still have no judgement. But yeah, just letting the carcasses rot on the banks seems shitty on many levels.

... and that is against Oregon regs (Wasting) "Wasting fish happens when an angler catches and then discards a fish. If you find dead, discarded fish on the bank without any evidence of it having been filleted or otherwise butchered, it’s been wasted." also considered poaching

How to recognize and report poaching on the water | Oregon Department of Fish & Wildlife

Each year, thousands of fish are harvested illegally in Oregon. Anglers who wait all year for their favorite salmon or steelhead run shouldn’t face reduced opportunity because of poaching. To report poaching call *OSP or 1-800-452-7888

myodfw.com

Cheers

 

[clarkman]

hopefully this thread can get back to the original intent for the OP.

 

[Anonymous member 148]

hopefully this thread can get back to the original intent for the OP.

I think @Buzzy Finished it off

 

[mems]

They wanted to make a movie about a killer carp. They were going to call it LIPS

 

[Engee]

Nice write up. This covers a lot of what you need to know. One critical take away that John Montana always emphasizes is that you need to know your forage.

Carp will adapt to feed on whatever food source is abundant in the waters they are in. Where I fish for them on the Columbia River we believe the primary food source is clams. Clams don't move, so our primary presentation is the "drag and drop". Once the fly hits the bottom we rarely move it. We hope the drop gets the carps attention and then we watch for its reaction to the fly. If it does anything different than what it was doing, we set. And the set is a hard trout set, not a strip set. If the carp doesn't appear to have seen the fly we don't strip. Stripping often spooks them. We typically will pick up and drop it on them again until they eat or spook.

The fly we use 95% of the time is the John Montana Hybrid. Clam neck tail, soft hackle body. Covers all the bases.
View attachment 53936


But I know in other places, like the great lakes, they primarily eat minnows and the water is very clear. So, in that fishery they throw big streamers that imitate gobeys and strip them aggressively. The carp will move several feet to chase them. I have never done it but it sounds like fun.

Sounds like Banks Lake has crayfish in the rocky areas. Different forage in the muddy areas. I caught carp in Lake Las Vegas stripping a swimming nymph on a medium fast retrieve. Wherever you plan to chase carp you need to know your forage.

Here are a few decent ones my wife and I caught. The last one weighed in at 20lbs.

View attachment 53937

View attachment 53938

View attachment 53939

Great photos. Here's one of what Buzzy and I affectionately call an Elephant Carp taken almost 20 years ago.

 

[Buzzy]

Nice write up. This covers a lot of what you need to know. One critical take away that John Montana always emphasizes is that you need to know your forage.

Carp will adapt to feed on whatever food source is abundant in the waters they are in. Where I fish for them on the Columbia River we believe the primary food source is clams. Clams don't move, so our primary presentation is the "drag and drop". Once the fly hits the bottom we rarely move it. We hope the drop gets the carps attention and then we watch for its reaction to the fly. If it does anything different than what it was doing, we set. And the set is a hard trout set, not a strip set. If the carp doesn't appear to have seen the fly we don't strip. Stripping often spooks them. We typically will pick up and drop it on them again until they eat or spook.

The fly we use 95% of the time is the John Montana Hybrid. Clam neck tail, soft hackle body. Covers all the bases.
View attachment 53936


But I know in other places, like the great lakes, they primarily eat minnows and the water is very clear. So, in that fishery they throw big streamers that imitate gobeys and strip them aggressively. The carp will move several feet to chase them. I have never done it but it sounds like fun.

Sounds like Banks Lake has crayfish in the rocky areas. Different forage in the muddy areas. I caught carp in Lake Las Vegas stripping a swimming nymph on a medium fast retrieve. Wherever you plan to chase carp you need to know your forage.

Here are a few decent ones my wife and I caught. The last one weighed in at 20lbs.

View attachment 53937

View attachment 53938

View attachment 53939

Chief - thanks for the reminder about knowing your forage, great advice. Be well/Pat

 

[Hem]

Great thread.
Another technique to try...

I fish local waters such as Canyon Ferry reservoir and the Missouri River.
The river is closest so I tend to fish here more frequently.
My favorite time to fish is when the run off is about done. Water levels are still high, but water temp is warming and clarity is improving. I have found carp to feed more aggressively at this juncture.
I simply walk banks, working downstream looking for carp hanging on the edge. Having an elevated ubrupt bank is a huge plus because it puts you slightly above their cone of vision.
Using a white bead headed bugger, I cast out over the river and swing the fly towards the carp. The key is getting the fly to swing across their nose about a foot in front...but it must be at eye level or lower, not higher. If the carp is in eating mode they typically will turn and follow the fly to inspect. Best part is the fly is highly visible to you so you can watch the fish inhale it with a flare of the gills. There are times when this works well on 2-3 fish holding together, one fish wants to beat out the others for a meal.
Later in summer the fish get lazier but the technique still works.

You might also try sight casting a red San Juan worm with a brass bead if the water is clear, or a gold bead if the water is pretty off color. I've had good success, but setting the hook becomes a learned process. As Buzzy said, tail movement or fins that flutter indicating a fish is excited and about to eat.

I've caught carp on dries only when they are gulping, but not many.

River carp IMO fight better than lake carp.
Whole lot of fun any which way.

 

[Buzzy]

Great thread.
Another technique to try...

I fish local waters such as Canyon Ferry reservoir and the Missouri River.
The river is closest so I tend to fish here more frequently.
My favorite time to fish is when the run off is about done. Water levels are still high, but water temp is warming and clarity is improving. I have found carp to feed more aggressively at this juncture.
I simply walk banks, working downstream looking for carp hanging on the edge. Having an elevated ubrupt bank is a huge plus because it puts you slightly above their cone of vision.
Using a white bead headed bugger, I cast out over the river and swing the fly towards the carp. The key is getting the fly to swing across their nose about a foot in front...but it must be at eye level or lower, not higher. If the carp is in eating mode they typically will turn and follow the fly to inspect. Best part is the fly is highly visible to you so you can watch the fish inhale it with a flare of the gills. There are times when this works well on 2-3 fish holding together, one fish wants to beat out the others for a meal.
Later in summer the fish get lazier but the technique still works.

You might also try sight casting a red San Juan worm with a brass bead if the water is clear, or a gold bead if the water is pretty off color. I've had good success, but setting the hook becomes a learned process. As Buzzy said, tail movement or fins that flutter indicating a fish is excited and about to eat.

I've caught carp on dries only when they are gulping, but not many.

River carp IMO fight better than lake carp.
Whole lot of fun any which way.

This sounds like such a blast. Want some company? ;-) I've fished the Columbia many times for carp but always in the reservoirs above dams, to hace that added advantage to the fish of "current". I need to expand my horizons. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Hem]

This sounds like such a blast. Want some company? ;-) I've fished the Columbia many times for carp but always in the reservoirs above dams, to hace that added advantage to the fish of "current". I need to expand my horizons. Thanks for sharing.

Anytime you are coming to the Gallatin Valley give me the heads up,...game on.
On the flipside, I'm desperate to fish for bass( carp too) this year in Washington.
Might need some pointers.

 

[Buzzy]

Anytime you are coming to the Gallatin Valley give me the heads up,...game on.
On the flipside, I'm desperate to fish for bass( carp too) this year in Washington.
Might need some pointers.

Maybe we can lasso @Billy for some bassin'! Stay in touch.

 

[Zak]

Got my carp setup in the mail last week. I still need to order a bow fishing reel and arrows.
View attachment 53949
View attachment 53950
I figure I'll start out seeing if they will eat a fly if not let the arrows fly, either way the tomatoes are getting fertilized.

That is so cool! I've had a couple wristrockets but that thing is serious!

 

[Anonymous member 148]

That is so cool! I've had a couple wristrockets but that thing is serious!

It's pretty slick, I thought Mr. Long Rod might enjoy that since we've discussed bows before. Simpleshot makes that set up and it comes with interchangeable heads, one for arrows and one for bands. I also got a rail adapter for the grip base to mount a reel.

 

[MT406]

Great thread.
Another technique to try...

I fish local waters such as Canyon Ferry reservoir and the Missouri River.
The river is closest so I tend to fish here more frequently.
My favorite time to fish is when the run off is about done. Water levels are still high, but water temp is warming and clarity is improving. I have found carp to feed more aggressively at this juncture.
I simply walk banks, working downstream looking for carp hanging on the edge. Having an elevated ubrupt bank is a huge plus because it puts you slightly above their cone of vision.
Using a white bead headed bugger, I cast out over the river and swing the fly towards the carp. The key is getting the fly to swing across their nose about a foot in front...but it must be at eye level or lower, not higher. If the carp is in eating mode they typically will turn and follow the fly to inspect. Best part is the fly is highly visible to you so you can watch the fish inhale it with a flare of the gills. There are times when this works well on 2-3 fish holding together, one fish wants to beat out the others for a meal.
Later in summer the fish get lazier but the technique still works.

You might also try sight casting a red San Juan worm with a brass bead if the water is clear, or a gold bead if the water is pretty off color. I've had good success, but setting the hook becomes a learned process. As Buzzy said, tail movement or fins that flutter indicating a fish is excited and about to eat.

I've caught carp on dries only when they are gulping, but not many.

River carp IMO fight better than lake carp.
Whole lot of fun any which way.

Good intel. Is Canyon Ferry that much better during the spawn then the river? Always concentrated my efforts on fishing the river, but I keep hearing the best time to fish for carp is during the spawn..

 

[Hem]

Good intel. Is Canyon Ferry that much better during the spawn then the river? Always concentrated my efforts on fishing the river, but I keep hearing the best time to fish for carp is during the spawn..

Actually, I avoid the spawn. Generally the fish are too distracted to bother with. They are actively spawning not feeding with all the commotion.

 

[Buzzy]

Actually, I avoid the spawn. Generally the fish are too distracted to bother with. They are actively spawning not feeding with all the commotion.

I agree, it's a rare carp that will eat when almost all "the herd" are focused on spawning.

 

[Matt Paluch]

Good intel. Is Canyon Ferry that much better during the spawn then the river? Always concentrated my efforts on fishing the river, but I keep hearing the best time to fish for carp is during the spawn..

It's the opposite. Spawners aren't eaters.

 

[Bass-O-Matic]

Never say never...

Spawning carp are tough to impossible I agree but here are several experiences I had over the years on the Columbia.

We headed to a well known Grant County slough and as we approached (by boat) the zone it was clear the mob was was in a full-tilt frenzy. They had the water stirred up the degree you could only see maybe 20" with fish going every which way away from the grass and banks. That's different than running the grass, dropping fertilizing eggs. That part went down a couple hours later. So you had zero chance of seeing your fly on the bottom and zero chance of seeing a carp take. To our thinking the best bet was a reactionary strike. We went with large (for normal carp fishing) black leeches as that was what would stand out in the chocolate. You never saw a fish for more than a second or two so watching for a radical move or feeling a strike was all you dare hope for. These were the early spawners that in my experience are larger fish on average, 18lbs + that know the routine. We got a couple handfuls to our amazement. It was totally quick-draw McDraw very short casts when you saw a flash of bronze that was a little different color. The fish were stir crazy. a struck like a smallmouth.

I think the most common approach people try is to move away from the "active spawners" in hopes of finding a few strays that for whatever reason decided they need a bite to eat. But it's anything but reliable to even find such fish. I've had luck at times with this tactic but it's always with fish 50 or more yards from the action.

Last and maybe most interesting... I was on foot back in a slough and it was full-on spawn. One gal at a time running the grass edge dropping eggs with 4-8 males trying to pass their genes on in pursuit. I stood and watched this for some time always keeping an eye out for loners cruising about not engaged the act. The particular shoreline was an idea depth and a straight line for 100+ feet until for whatever reason, which just seemed to be that the tules jutted out into deeper water at a 90 degree angle. The carp would make their run when the came to the wall so to speak they acted like they hit their head "blissfully" and where stunned and sort of went into a despersion drift you might say. I watch this for maybe 20 minutes and concluded that was where my chance lie. When they were drifting away I felt I had a shot to take a fish with a fly well place fly that was easy pickens. It worked. Does one need that hard angle to break up the party? No, but it afforded me a reliable party ending spot to target. Worked like a charm.

So my point is there may be opportunities even under difficult circumstances. More often than not the best bet was switch to bass fishing or head for the tavern.


On another note regarding flies. One summer I fished the very same store bought French Straw Stonefly nymph the entire summer and did great. This was mostly on the Columbia but not exclusively, where there are no stoneflies. It worked particularly well on cobble flats in clear water. Very natural, buggy looking fly that wasn't obvious to the eye so the anglers presentation was critical. Sometimes an understated fly and an accurate stealth cast is all you need.