Bellwether Social Media trial

RCF said:
I completely agree @Josh . I apologize for not being clearer.

I was trying to differiate between everyday posts which Section 230 covers well and AI/large social network creators allowing/supporting anything to make bigger bucks, and designing them to get more users and creating and supporting addictive behavior as well as supporting creation of stuff like porn.
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As I understand it, the cases that have been ruled against Meta and Google are not considered to be encroaching on 230. They're focusing on testimony and documents showing that Meta (and apparently Google too) knew their product was harmful, particularly to children, and chose not to do anything about it. Here's a quote from an article in the Economist.

"Kaley’s lawyers took a different approach. Rather than trying to hold Meta and Google responsible for the harmful content hosted on their platforms, they attacked them for the way the platforms are designed. They showed the jury internal company documents demonstrating that executives knew of their products’ harmful effects on children, and argued that features like auto-playing videos, personalised recommendations and infinite feeds were designed to lure youngsters."
 
flybill said:
Doesn't matter.. neice, nephews and being a web developer plus social media expert makes it so. I know how to lock down a phone.. either you're being a smart ass or just an ass Mr TRAVERS!
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Lulz. Clown statement, bro. Yeah, it matters.

Pretending otherwise is like claiming to understand military service after reading a bunch of warfare books and watching the history channel.

While it's not impossible to have a deep understanding of what it takes to raise kids without having any of your own, it's pretty rare and limited to a few dedicated and empathetic people who make it part of their life's work. More importantly, nobody who fits that description would ever make sweeping statements about "Parents should just do blah blah blah" because they would also know how incredibly complex parenting is. Especially in today's world. Every parent, every child, every home, every situation is different.

"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing." - Socrates
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Josh said:
Lulz. Clown statement, bro. Yeah, it matters.

Pretending otherwise is like claiming to understand military service after reading a bunch of warfare books and watching the history channel.

While it's not impossible to have a deep understanding of what it takes to raise kids without having any of your own, it's pretty rare and limited to a few dedicated and empathetic people who make it part of their life's work. More importantly, nobody who fits that description would ever make sweeping statements about "Parents should just do blah blah blah" because they would also know how incredibly complex parenting is. Especially in today's world. Every parent, every child, every home, every situation is different.
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I can have an opinion. Is everyone who became an expert on Covid a medical person. And I'm talking in general. And mostly about using the technology to limit kids use. Regardless I've been around kids of friends and family. So you can complain about my opinions or just ignore them.. or delete them.. I'm going fishing..
 
Josh said:
Lulz. Clown statement, bro. Yeah, it matters.

Pretending otherwise is like claiming to understand military service after reading a bunch of warfare books and watching the history channel.

While it's not impossible to have a deep understanding of what it takes to raise kids without having any of your own, it's pretty rare and limited to a few dedicated and empathetic people who make it part of their life's work. More importantly, nobody who fits that description would ever make sweeping statements about "Parents should just do blah blah blah" because they would also know how incredibly complex parenting is. Especially in today's world. Every parent, every child, every home, every situation is different.
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Well he may not have kids but he isn't wrong and I have had kids turn into successful adults by the way. Parents do need to be parents. As an example, I regularly see parents using their cellphone as a baby sitter. I know that's not going to end well.
 
raised three kids and interactive with 6 grandkids currently in 8th grade - seniors in college. You can set down enforceable rules, discuss logic vs emotional reactions, the impact of good vs bad decisions, creating a look ahead focus instead of being captive to the moment....but in the end...
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Josh said:
Lulz. Clown statement, bro. Yeah, it matters.

Pretending otherwise is like claiming to understand military service after reading a bunch of warfare books and watching the history channel.

While it's not impossible to have a deep understanding of what it takes to raise kids without having any of your own, it's pretty rare and limited to a few dedicated and empathetic people who make it part of their life's work. More importantly, nobody who fits that description would ever make sweeping statements about "Parents should just do blah blah blah" because they would also know how incredibly complex parenting is. Especially in today's world. Every parent, every child, every home, every situation is different.
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Your kids are your responsibility. Not the government, not society, not anybody else but you and your wife or partner.

8 see a whole lot of Americans taking a low effort parenting style route then acting like society owes them childcare and educating their children on everything. Those kids generally end up worse for it. And if your kids shoot up a school? Well I think you should be hung right along side them.

People without kids are plenty in their lane to have an opinion about them if parents keep making their kids and responsibility that goes with them put on those of us without them. Hell I think you should be taxed on kids rather then get a break.

I'm not saying you are a shity parent. But I am saying there are plenty of them that shirk accountability as, "well raising kids is tough." Yeah it is. And the success of doing it or the lack of such is on the parents. Why does nobody understand the concept of accountability in this country today. Why? Because you can always litigate, blame teachers, blame music, blame videogames, blame their friends, blame society, blame the government, blame God, blame guns, blame social media, blame addiction, blame schools, and so on. That is top flight clown behaviour and coping.
 
Painting everything with such a broad stroke probably isn't the best strategy with both the lawsuit and with many of the responses [here] to it.

There is nuance to everything. Nothing is black and white. There is a reason there's a bell curve with every single population one can think of....
 
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Dustin Chromers said:
Your kids are your responsibility. Not the government, not society, not anybody else but you and your wife or partner.

8 see a whole lot of Americans taking a low effort parenting style route then acting like society owes them childcare and educating their children on everything. Those kids generally end up worse for it. And if your kids shoot up a school? Well I think you should be hung right along side them.

People without kids are plenty in their lane to have an opinion about them if parents keep making their kids and responsibility that goes with them put on those of us without them. Hell I think you should be taxed on kids rather then get a break.

I'm not saying you are a shity parent. But I am saying there are plenty of them that shirk accountability as, "well raising kids is tough." Yeah it is. And the success of doing it or the lack of such is on the parents. Why does nobody understand the concept of accountability in this country today. Why? Because you can always litigate, blame teachers, blame music, blame videogames, blame their friends, blame society, blame the government, blame God, blame guns, blame social media, blame addiction, blame schools, and so on. That is top flight clown behaviour and coping.
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Dude, what?

Where did I bring up all of this societal stuff you’ve so strongly clapped back at me about? Show me.

I said armchair quarterbacks are lame. And they are.
 
Of course parents are responsible for their kids. But this trial was about something else. It wasn't about the content people post on the platforms. It was the programming by the platform owners and developers who knowingly programmed the platform to be addictive, and especially addictive to children. I'm pretty sure the kids weren't aware of that. And most parents weren't aware of that, at least not until recently. And the companies did in fact do this, according to their own inside information. If one is prohibited from selling addictive drugs to kids, does it make sense to allow Meta and Google to purvey a negatively addictive platform?

Personally, I don't understand why parents would give a kid a cell phone. Especially a $1,000 smart phone that the kid will probably lose every 6 months or so. I know my kids would have done without. And if they screamed about it, I'd simply duct tape their mouth. There is a parenting solution for most any behavior. But then there would be home computer use, and kids are probably smarter than their parents when it comes to programming it, so there's that bit . . .
 
Josh said:
Dude, what?

Where did I bring up all of this societal stuff you’ve so strongly clapped back at me about? Show me.

I said armchair quarterbacks are lame. And they are.
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I don't think we are communicating effectively. Arm chair quarterbacks are well entitled to an opinion when regulation to protect kids who's parents aren't doing their job of that impact their lives. I loath regulation or litigation to protect kids who's parents aren't doing the job. I feel the same way when society needs to be protected from someone's perfect little neglected monsters. Is that clear? And I don't even know what clapping back means. I'm not a14 year old girl and am not up on the online speak. I think I got an idea based on context. If you can't connect the dots and see the relevance I am unable to help. Horses and water and all that. Some clowns are in the circus professionally and some just are because. It's certainty not just because they have an opinion on the circus without going pro.
 
just making sure everyone knew what a bell curve is mentioned earlier.....never can be too certain these days.

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like and follow for more tips & tricks!
 
flybill said:
Doesn't matter.. neice, nephews and being a web developer plus social media expert makes it so. I know how to lock down a phone.. either you're being a smart ass or just an ass Mr TRAVERS!
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Experience is a hard teacher. She gives the test first, and the lessons later.
Has anyone ever done something that their parents wouldn't approve of and got away with it. Sneaking out, smoking, drinking, smoking pot, dropping acid, kissing your crush, doing something else with your crush, cursing, etc.etc. If so, is that your parents fault?
 
If I learned anything from parenting it's something akin to what josh posted :
"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing." - Socrates
I did not know how inimportant you are in portions of your kids life while simultaneously being the most important thing in their lives and being responsible to keep them alive. Humility is required for succesful parenting because you really need to spend much more time and effort listening and far less attempting to impart your own thoughts onto them.

I thought that parenting would be far different than it turned out to be. In the end, you can actively screw a person up by hiting them or your spouse, smoking crack etc. Even then, they may turn out to be a good person. You will have given them all sort of scars though. Some people are better at healing than others.

What you can't really do is make them into a good person or make them into what you want them to be. You can't make them thrive. Parents don't create ethical, moral, happy, sucessful children. They can only attempt to give that person all the tools that hey can for them to become those positive things. Honestly, I think too much effort to shape a kid will more likely than not end up with you scarring them. They come out who they are in a lot of ways.

In the whole nature vs. nurture thing, it is difficultto determine which is more important for any one situation, trait, habit, decision etc.

I'm curious as to whether the real issue with social media and kids is that it becomes such a constant source for direction and feedback. Direction and feedback can be either good or bad. I think that in this case the volume may be a larger issue than the actual content.
 
RCF said:
My wife's mother just bought a brand new phone ------> a flip phone!

More should follow her lead...

@Bambooflyguy 😁
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Big button simple phones for older folks are useful.

In the bell curve of adoption strategies, and in opposition to strategies to get kids to adopt and use, these platforms and devices go almost out of their way to make them NOT useable for older people with limited eyesight, tremors, memory problems and so on.

The irony there is the very puzzle of how to use the phone combined with the connections they enable, probably helps preserve some degree of cognitive function. They are certainly a bridge to other worlds, they are never going away.

In the hands of the unskeptical (either young or old and good ole fashion dumb) the bridges to stupid, racist, paranoid, untrue, dangerous, divisive worlds are easy to cross. The hips on the bell curve are wide....

As for Bell Curves, I think on this issue at the very least we have not an inverted Koudaidon but more of a flipped Hira Tayoudon

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Shouldn't we be thinking in FF terms for distribution discussions?

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