The San Juan Worm

Matt B said:
My most charitable guess would be that it’s because it is pretty much impossible for an enforcement officer to tell a salt-impregnated plastic bait from a standard plastic bait/lure, and since it has been said that fish treat the salt-impregnated plastics pretty much like real deal bait, they just ban all the plastics in artificial-only waters. And I haven’t read the recent Oregon regs about this that you write of so I’m really going out on a limb here.
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Matt B said:
@Matt B I do believe ur correct, that being the basis for the ban. Thanks for the input.
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I saw a video recently regarding worms on Michigan’s Manistee by Dead Drift Guide service. Just a crazy amount of worms floating down river. No wonder the San Juan worm works so well in imitating the natural.
SF
 
Matt B said:
My most charitable guess would be that it’s because it is pretty much impossible for an enforcement officer to tell a salt-impregnated plastic bait from a standard plastic bait/lure, and since it has been said that fish treat the salt-impregnated plastics pretty much like real deal bait, they just ban all the plastics in artificial-only waters. And I haven’t read the recent Oregon regs about this that you write of so I’m really going out on a limb here.
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pls 'poit' us toward the specific regulation regarding plastics
Draketake said:
What @Pigs said regarding the Rubber Bodied San Juan Worms
I’ve spent a ton of time researching this recently. Taken as the Oregon Regs are currently written,
They are also illegal on the
Metolius
Fall River
Crooked River too now that its an Artificial Lures and Flies only River
Makes zero sense.
Maybe someone smarter than me can research it deeper and let me know what their interpretation is.

Bob
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pls provide a link to the specific regulation prohibiting silicone bodied worms on the rivers you stated.
 
SurfnFish said:
pls 'poit' us toward the specific regulation regarding plastics

pls provide a link to the specific regulation prohibiting rubber bodied worm on the rivers you stated.
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No, as I wrote, I just guessed the reason behind what was stated without verifying and I won’t be analyzing OR regs unless I plan to fish there.
 
Matt B said:
No, as I wrote, I just guessed the reason behind what was stated without verifying and I won’t be analyzing OR regs unless I plan to fish there.
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meant this for Pigs, inadequate caffeine level....cannot find such a reg against such use. Otherwise the silicone leg stoneflies and other such flies commonly used on these rivers would be illegal as well. Artificial and barbless is the only rule within in any of the online regs.
I only use the ones I tie at the lakes...the snobs on my local river might strain a fin muscle laughing if I floated one by them
 
@SurfnFish
I’m looking but if I remember correctly,
Oregon defines bait to include rubber accoutrements, attached on any hook. Thus, I believe, it would technically cover rubber legs even. I don’t think this is the spirit of the law but I think it is the letter of the law. So in Oregon, in places designated as Fly Fishing Only and in places designated as Lure and Fly only, anything rubber, placed on a hook, is not legal.

I think the intent of the law was to keep people from using say bait/scent impregnated, rubber grubs and/or rubber eggs, in places like the Fall River. I’ll try to find the ODFW definition of Bait again. I’ll try to post it in this thread but I’m not tech savvy.

Bob
 
Has no one noticed that a WORM IS NOT A FLY 😝 ... and yuse guys call yourselves "fly fishers";)

cheers
 
From Oregon Regs:

  • Bait: Any item used to attract fish that is not an artificial fly, lure or attractor. Molded soft plastic or rubber imitations of worms, eggs, insects, bait fish, crayfish, etc. are considered baits. Scent is not considered bait.
  • Artificial fly: A fly is a hook, dressed with conventional natural or synthetic fly tying materials. Tied in conjunction with other materials, wire (lead or other) used to weight the fly and dumbbell eyes or beads (metal, glass or plastic) may be part of the fly. A fly does not include sinkers, molded weights, spinners, spoons or similar attractors.
  • Lure: An artificial device, complete with hooks, intended to attract and entice fish; excludes artificial flies or attractors. Corkies, spin-n-glos, birdy drifters, leadhead jigs, hard plastic beads, etc. are considered lures. Molded soft plastic or rubber imitations of worms, eggs, insects, bait fish, crayfish, etc. are considered baits.
Just spit ballin' here but IMHO rubber legs are OK. Squirmies? Hmmm? Probably OK too because you don't buy them already molded looking like a worm imitation. You buy a long piece of stretchy stuff and fashion them into a "fly". Kind of a weak arguement.

BTW, I've had my license checked 4 times just this year in Central Oregon: Diamond, Metolius, Chickahominy and Billy C
 
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Wade Rivers said:
From Oregon Regs:

  • Bait: Any item used to attract fish that is not an artificial fly, lure or attractor. Molded soft plastic or rubber imitations of worms, eggs, insects, bait fish, crayfish, etc. are considered baits. Scent is not considered bait.
  • Artificial fly: A fly is a hook, dressed with conventional natural or synthetic fly tying materials. Tied in conjunction with other materials, wire (lead or other) used to weight the fly and dumbbell eyes or beads (metal, glass or plastic) may be part of the fly. A fly does not include sinkers, molded weights, spinners, spoons or similar attractors.
  • Lure: An artificial device, complete with hooks, intended to attract and entice fish; excludes artificial flies or attractors. Corkies, spin-n-glos, birdy drifters, leadhead jigs, hard plastic beads, etc. are considered lures. Molded soft plastic or rubber imitations of worms, eggs, insects, bait fish, crayfish, etc. are considered baits.
Just spit ballin' here but IMHO rubber legs are OK. Squirmies? Hmmm? Probably OK too because you don't buy them already molded looking like a worm imitation. You buy a long piece of stretchy stuff and fashion them into a "fly". Kind of a weak arguement.

BTW, I've had my license checked 4 times just this year in Central Oregon: Diamond, Metolius, Chickahominy and Billy C
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No Pistol Pete flies, then.
 
You got it, dry flies, cane, and tweed!!!!!!

Cheers
 
Wade Rivers said:
From Oregon Regs:

  • Bait: Any item used to attract fish that is not an artificial fly, lure or attractor. Molded soft plastic or rubber imitations of worms, eggs, insects, bait fish, crayfish, etc. are considered baits. Scent is not considered bait.
  • Artificial fly: A fly is a hook, dressed with conventional natural or synthetic fly tying materials. Tied in conjunction with other materials, wire (lead or other) used to weight the fly and dumbbell eyes or beads (metal, glass or plastic) may be part of the fly. A fly does not include sinkers, molded weights, spinners, spoons or similar attractors.
  • Lure: An artificial device, complete with hooks, intended to attract and entice fish; excludes artificial flies or attractors. Corkies, spin-n-glos, birdy drifters, leadhead jigs, hard plastic beads, etc. are considered lures. Molded soft plastic or rubber imitations of worms, eggs, insects, bait fish, crayfish, etc. are considered baits.
Just spit ballin' here but IMHO rubber legs are OK. Squirmies? Hmmm? Probably OK too because you don't buy them already molded looking like a worm imitation. You buy a long piece of stretchy stuff and fashion them into a "fly". Kind of a weak arguement.

BTW, I've had my license checked 4 times just this year in Central Oregon: Diamond, Metolius, Chickahominy and Billy C
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Thanks @Wade Rivers for posting this.

I’m hoping maybe an OSP Game Trooper will chime in on their interpretation.
 
flybill said:
Might as well put some weight on it and go squid jigging!! 😄
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Or fish it around a ferry dock, the thing would look like a free drifting pile worm & you know those don't survive long.
 
Wade Rivers said:
From Oregon Regs:

  • Bait: Any item used to attract fish that is not an artificial fly, lure or attractor. Molded soft plastic or rubber imitations of worms, eggs, insects, bait fish, crayfish, etc. are considered baits. Scent is not considered bait.
  • Artificial fly: A fly is a hook, dressed with conventional natural or synthetic fly tying materials. Tied in conjunction with other materials, wire (lead or other) used to weight the fly and dumbbell eyes or beads (metal, glass or plastic) may be part of the fly. A fly does not include sinkers, molded weights, spinners, spoons or similar attractors.
  • Lure: An artificial device, complete with hooks, intended to attract and entice fish; excludes artificial flies or attractors. Corkies, spin-n-glos, birdy drifters, leadhead jigs, hard plastic beads, etc. are considered lures. Molded soft plastic or rubber imitations of worms, eggs, insects, bait fish, crayfish, etc. are considered baits.
Just spit ballin' here but IMHO rubber legs are OK. Squirmies? Hmmm? Probably OK too because you don't buy them already molded looking like a worm imitation. You buy a long piece of stretchy stuff and fashion them into a "fly". Kind of a weak arguement.

BTW, I've had my license checked 4 times just this year in Central Oregon: Diamond, Metolius, Chickahominy and Billy C
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It’s a pretty lame reg…..also, scent is not considered bait. So you can hit ur flies with garlic cheese spray or whatever. Sweet

I suppose you can make the argument you said….we need further clarification
 
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