Sage is no longer on my radar

Porter2

Porter2

Legend
Bit of a ramble. But I do have justification.

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All but three rods are sages. Have two TFO’s. Oh wait there's a Fenwick which is naughty rod. It’s conventional gear. Because at times I do swing both ways. Any ways. I’m very disappointed in Sage fly rods. I’m not disappointed in their tech or performance all though I think they have been missing that mark in last few years IMHO. Thought the X was not that great of rod. Taking 5-6 weeks to respond to an email? A friend broke his spey tip with fish on and now 200 bucks? This was an Euro XP type rod… hmm 🤨. I’m full
Of RPL’s, Xp’s, axis and a Xi3 and Bolt plus awesome Ds 583 and the DS2 490-4. I added
on 3 896-4 Xps because when I lose that baby no other rod will match imho.

But I will no longer add sage to my shopping list of searching for a new rod. Because old are screwed and new is what? An ounce or two better or not ?
 
Porter2 said:
Bit of a ramble. But I do have justification.

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All but three rods are sages. Have two TFO’s. Oh wait there's a Fenwick which is naughty rod. It’s conventional gear. Because at times I do swing both ways. Any ways. I’m very disappointed in Sage fly rods. I’m not disappointed in their tech or performance all though I think they have been missing that mark in last few years IMHO. Thought the X was not that great of rod. Taking 5-6 weeks to respond to an email? A friend broke his spey tip with fish on and now 200 bucks? This was an Euro XP type rod… hmm 🤨. I’m full
Of RPL’s, Xp’s, axis and a Xi3 and Bolt plus awesome Ds 583 and the DS2 490-4. I added
on 3 896-4 Xps because when I lose that baby no other rod will match imho.

But I will no longer add sage to my shopping list of searching for a new rod. Because old are screwed and new is what? An ounce or two better or not ?
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I will not speak to the customer service or the cost of repairs but after having cast a few of their rods compared to another major manufacturer I have absolutely nothing bad to say about Sage rods. If I was in need of a new mid- high end rod Sage would be very high on my list probably 2nd in line. Their performance and feel really outstrips other rods I have cast. you do however have to like fast rods.
 
Rob Allen said:
I will not speak to the customer service or the cost of repairs but after having cast a few of their rods compared to another major manufacturer I have absolutely nothing bad to say about Sage rods. If I was in need of a new mid- high end rod Sage would be very high on my list probably 2nd in line. Their performance and feel really outstrips other rods I have cast. you do however have to like fast rods.
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I agree. For fast rod applications, Sage outshines most others I have tried. Beach rods in particular. IMO, Scott is the only other company that’s a true competitor in that realm. I think that performance comes at a price though. The super fast, light Sage rods I own are all incredibly fragile. Now, for most other applications outside of salt, give me something else. Anything else. You might catch me throwing streamers on a Sage rod in a river or a lake but dries and nymphs… so many other, better options IMO.

Will say, the last two customer service experiences have been much better with Sage. Repairs done in weeks versus months during Covid.
 
The r8 is a good stick I’ve fished a few and actually really liked them. They brought back a little feel after going too hard in the konnetic era chasing ultra fast and ultra light and making rods that do little else well but throw the full fly line IMO. Ultra fast and ultra light came at the cost of being fragile. Sage is NOT the only manufacturer who lost the plot of making a fishing rod and not just one made to cast. Where Sage soured me was not in the latest flagship rods (i do own and love a 697 igniter for its purposes) but in changing the warranty policy on rods I’ve owned for years. $200 to repair an XP that was sold with an unconditional lifetime warranty is wild to me. However there is a lot of really nice fly rods out there by all the manufacturers. If you look through my collection of rods you’ll see I care less about the manufacturer or the price and more about its utility. Does it do the job that I bought it for well? I think Scott does an excellent job of making a fast action rod that has enough feel to be touchy and intuitive. Just looking at your tubes there I’d have to recommend you cast some Scott’s. The centric is a really sweet stick depending on what you’re after.
 
When the rod repair is no longer supported by the manufacturer for that model or it costs more for the repair than a used rod, time to move on.

I am constant lookout for used models.

Note: BTW fast action rods are not my style.
 
Scott and Loomis are the only fly rods I fish at present. Excellent fly rods! In all truth though a dedicated angler will catch plenty of fish with any fly rod model.

Sage has dominant market share, but others make superior all around fly rods.
 
Loomis IM6 are my favorite. Winston is a close second. Loomis IMX for faster action, but slower by today's standards.
 
Not a Sage fan by any means, but breaking a tip section on a fish, especially on a Euro nymph rod (which inherintly has a very fragile tip) isn't necessarily the rod manufacturer's fault. If graphite is defective or improperly built, it will break within the first few times it's put under load. Past that, something would need to have changed on the graphite, likely from being hit or nicked on something, before failing like that.

I've been on that side of the desk before, so know the situation very, very well. Granted, I'd never own a rod that cost me $200 to fix one of four sections, but rolling single sections of a fly rod is time consuming and costly for a manufacturer, and rods like Euro rods go through a lot of them. So doing what they can to not lose their ass is understandable.
 
I have never owned a sage, but I have witnessed the company go from taking very very good care of their customers to where they are now. It's hard for me to comprehend how they could be losing their ass at the prices they sell their stuff for.
If I buy a snap on tool, at four or five times the price of say craftsman, I expect a broken tool to be replaced immediately at no cost to me. I already paid for the replacement up front.
 
Rob Allen said:
I will not speak to the customer service or the cost of repairs but after having cast a few of their rods compared to another major manufacturer I have absolutely nothing bad to say about Sage rods. If I was in need of a new mid- high end rod Sage would be very high on my list probably 2nd in line. Their performance and feel really outstrips other rods I have cast. you do however have to like fast rods.
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Rob -
Curious, you've touched a lot of rods, who would you say is first in line?
 
nwbobber said:
I have never owned a sage, but I have witnessed the company go from taking very very good care of their customers to where they are now. It's hard for me to comprehend how they could be losing their ass at the prices they sell their stuff for.
If I buy a snap on tool, at four or five times the price of say craftsman, I expect a broken tool to be replaced immediately at no cost to me. I already paid for the replacement up front.
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Because rod sections are hand-built. Time and materials cost money, and building in the USA isn't cheap.
 
I get a kick out of these kinds of threads. I will (fill in the blank) such and such a company. I will never own a rod from such and such a company. Or I will only use rods from such and such a company.

Every rod/line combination performs differently for every caster. Its very much to each his own.

Now that said most all my rods are Sage and will continue to be. Made in the USA. End of story for me.
 
Evan B said:
especially on a Euro nymph rod (which inherintly has a very fragile tip) isn't necessarily the rod manufacturer's fault.
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I think he was saying it was the old euro spey rod line (not a euro nymph rod). The had a line of spey rods they dubbed 'euro' AKA the greenie.
 
I am the opposite of a loyal fly fisher. I do own a couple Sages (690 DS2 and 2710 TCL-F). The first was my first graphite rod, and the second was part of a light line experiment. I like both rods, but use them rarely, as my fishing is in between those weights, mostly 4 weight. But I have Winston, TFO, Echo, Edge, Hardy (my 590 Zenith is my favorite rod), Orvis, Winston, and several home-made rods.

But at two years old, the Edge (486) is my newest rod, and the next newest is probably ten years older.

I will say that when my wife broke off the tip of my Graphite II Sage LL 4711, they replaced the tip just before COVID for $50, I think. Since it was a very old rod, I was more than happy to pay that. I was surprised that they still had the mandrels and material, but they confirmed that they did. I was quite pleased with their service.

Update: Since I busted that LL a second time, this time the butt end, I registered it on Sage's repair page, and wouldn't you know it, they accepted it. I sent it in today. I'll let you all know how much it costs, if they can repair it, and how long it'll take. FAIK, they'll take one look at it and send it back.
 
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Creatch’r said:
Where Sage soured me was not in the latest flagship rods (i do own and love a 697 igniter for its purposes) but in changing the warranty policy on rods I’ve owned for years. $200 to repair an XP that was sold with an unconditional lifetime warranty is wild to me.
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Agreed. Feel the same way. I also think back about how many times we'd see someone selling a used sage rod "with blank warranty" card. The collective "we" kind of abused the system to an extent, so not surprised they changed things up. Not saying I like their decision, but it makes some sense.
 
Long_Rod_Silvers said:
The collective "we" kind of abused the system to an extent, so not surprised they changed things up.
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And this has been discussed at length, but I think it was a year or two back on here. I've seen it first hand from the manufacturer's standpoint. It is so much worse than people think, too. There's a reason the entire industry made a shift in the last 5 or so years: They basically had to. The volume of abuse was to the point that they just couldn't do it anymore, so had to make compromises.

It's not based on greed like many would accuse companies of: It's just plain survival and trying to be able to offer SOMETHING on both past and present rods.
 
Sage had repaired my 486 LL GIII twice, both times for about $30 (and both times user error). The last time was years ago, though.

If I break it again, I'd pay the increased fee to fix it and still think I'm getting my money's worth from a rod that's brought me joy for 25+ years.
 
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