OP Steelhead Face ESA Listing

GOTY

Steelhead
A petition to list Olympic Peninsula steelhead under federal Endangered Species Act protections has been accepted by the National Marine Fisheries Service, which will now do a deep dive on the request from the Wild Fish Conservancy and The Conservation Angler.

"We find that the petition presents substantial scientific and commercial information indicating the listing may be warranted. We will conduct a status review of OP steelhead to determine whether listing is warranted. To ensure that the status review is comprehensive, we are soliciting scientific and commercial information pertaining to this species from any interested party,” NMFS writes in a prefiling this morning on the Federal Register.


 

RCF

Life of the Party
Will be interesting to read the arguments for and against. Science vs. Politics, money vs. heritage/rights, etc.
 

Rob Allen

Life of the Party
I am all for protecting species, steelhead inparticular but ESA has not helped a single steelhead run anywhere and had hurt fishing opportunities badly. To whatever extent we have a say in the matter we should oppose it.
 

brownheron

corvus ossifragus
Whether it happens or doesn't, I truly doubt the tribes will stop fishing.
This is exactly why I'm concerned about this too.

For example, in last year's early closure when no one was supposed to be fishing, I heard a large banging outside and saw a driftboat with anglers and fishing gear bumping down through the rapid behind my house. Obviously, my first thought was "WTF, the river is closed and they had to have launched at the hatchery right next to the ranger station...?".

Making a few calls, I found out the "tribal sport fishery" was still open with the 2 a day KILL limit. No one mentioned that in the news releases... That boat went by most days and if there were a few others lower down (I heard there were), the 100% dead fish impacts were a likely a lot more than the mathematically projected potentially dead fish due to incidental mortality. I was assured by a several non-profit leaders (who I have given a lot of money) that the tribes were not taking their 'foregone opportunity' rights. Well, if it looks like a duck...

I try not to be cynical but being out here and seeing this kind of mismanagement bullshit first hand has changed my outlook quite a bit.
 

Evan B

Bobber Downey Jr.
Staff member
Admin
This is exactly why I'm concerned about this too.

For example, in last year's early closure when no one was supposed to be fishing, I heard a large banging outside and saw a driftboat with anglers and fishing gear bumping down through the rapid behind my house. Obviously, my first thought was "WTF, the river is closed and they had to have launched at the hatchery right next to the ranger station...?".

Making a few calls, I found out the "tribal sport fishery" was still open with the 2 a day KILL limit. No one mentioned that in the news releases... That boat went by most days and if there were a few others lower down (I heard there were), the 100% dead fish impacts were a likely a lot more than the mathematically projected potentially dead fish due to incidental mortality. I was assured by a several non-profit leaders (who I have given a lot of money) that the tribes were not taking their 'foregone opportunity' rights. Well, if it looks like a duck...

I try not to be cynical but being out here and seeing this kind of mismanagement bullshit first hand has changed my outlook quite a bit.
Yup, watching this situation over the last nearly 2 decades... I've just been given zero reason to think the tribes will participate in any closures, or any real rules at all when it comes to the OP. They can and will essentially act with impunity, because who's going to stop them?
 

Evan B

Bobber Downey Jr.
Staff member
Admin
If listing PS steelhead has done anything productive and anyone reading this knows what that is, I am happy to hear it.
I think the thing it's helped the most with is getting eyes off the water so the poachers can do their thing.

When I still lived up that way, I used to snorkel some Puget Sound rivers during the late winter closed months. I saw people fishing almost every single time I was out (I liked to snorkel though some of the better steelhead fishing spots). Hell, I'd even snorkel the Reiter stretch, and see people in there of all places in the middle of Feb/Mar, well after it closed.
 

kerrys

Ignored Member
I think the thing it's helped the most with is getting eyes off the water so the poachers can do their thing.

When I still lived up that way, I used to snorkel some Puget Sound rivers during the late winter closed months. I saw people fishing almost every single time I was out (I liked to snorkel though some of the better steelhead fishing spots). Hell, I'd even snorkel the Reiter stretch, and see people in there of all places in the middle of Feb/Mar, well after it closed.
I bet I could take people to several spots on the Skagit where plunking gear is currently being fished.
 

Buzzy

I prefer to call them strike indicators.
Forum Supporter
I think the thing it's helped the most with is getting eyes off the water so the poachers can do their thing.

When I still lived up that way, I used to snorkel some Puget Sound rivers during the late winter closed months. I saw people fishing almost every single time I was out (I liked to snorkel though some of the better steelhead fishing spots). Hell, I'd even snorkel the Reiter stretch, and see people in there of all places in the middle of Feb/Mar, well after it closed.
Interesting. So it makes me wonder if all of our (fly fishing fraternity) law abiding, ethical behavior is really the way to go? I mean WTH, why not go fish the S rivers RIGHT NOW. It seems poachers poach, tribes continue fishing, why not the fly fishing fraternity? Just venting, I'm not really serious.

Up @JayB's way, his local river (an "M" river) hasn't been open to steelhead angling in how many years now?

Maybe It's past time for me to hang a for sale sign on my spey rod and Orvis CFO-VI.

Sorry for the thread drift, GOTY.
 

Smalma

Life of the Party
It is hard to make the case that the ESA listing of either the PS steelhead or Chinook has resulted in any meaningful increases in abundances of either species.

To the PS steelhead case the majority of the independent populations for the last one to 3 decades have not had any hatchery fish planted or meaningful fishing impacts (including in most case tribal fishing). This makes the case that in spite of the extended arguments in the steelhead fishing or conservation communities that the drive in the declining abundances since the 1980s had little to do how the fisheries were managed or the planting of hatchery steelhead (though both clearly do not do the fish any favors).

A major driver in the decline has been declining marine survival and deteriorating freshwater habitats. In the PS ESA recovery arena that major focus (dollars spend) has been in estuary restoration which does virtual nothing for steelhead.
 

Smalma

Life of the Party
Buzzy_
Our fly community is not without its ethical problems.

This past fall on the Stillaguamish the fishery for the mainstem coho and cutthroat fishery (stared September 1) as well as the North Fork game fish season (starting 9/16) was limited by Stillaguamish Chinook impact of 2 fish (20 encounters). Both sections (fishery) closed October first because they collectively reach the encounter limit. That decision was based on an on the river creel census which in addition to the standard information collected documented the Chinook encounters. It turns out that all those encounters were by fly anglers catching Chinook on the upper North Fork which in our lifetimes has not ever been open to salmon fishing. The "legitimate" anglers (whether targeting cutthroat or main stem coho lost significant fishing opportunity by what I consider unethical behavior by a relatively small handful of "fly anglers". They also may have put future fisheries at risk!

Curt
 

kerrys

Ignored Member
The "legitimate" anglers (whether targeting cutthroat or main stem coho lost significant fishing opportunity by what I consider unethical behavior by a relatively small handful of "fly anglers". They also may have put future fisheries at risk!

Curt
This has been going on for a long time. I watched “fly” fishermen targeting chinook at Hazel over thirty years ago. I’m sure it was happening before that. I laughed my ass off when one these bozos somehow managed to hook one and it destroyed his Sage fly rod.
 

Long_Rod_Silvers

Elder Millennial
Forum Supporter
Buzzy_
Our fly community is not without its ethical problems.

This past fall on the Stillaguamish the fishery for the mainstem coho and cutthroat fishery (stared September 1) as well as the North Fork game fish season (starting 9/16) was limited by Stillaguamish Chinook impact of 2 fish (20 encounters). Both sections (fishery) closed October first because they collectively reach the encounter limit. That decision was based on an on the river creel census which in addition to the standard information collected documented the Chinook encounters. It turns out that all those encounters were by fly anglers catching Chinook on the upper North Fork which in our lifetimes has not ever been open to salmon fishing. The "legitimate" anglers (whether targeting cutthroat or main stem coho lost significant fishing opportunity by what I consider unethical behavior by a relatively small handful of "fly anglers". They also may have put future fisheries at risk!

Curt
Does that mean that there were 20 chinook caught on the fly on the NF Stilly between 9/16 and 10/1?
Am I reading that right?
 

Smalma

Life of the Party
Does that mean that there were 20 chinook caught on the fly on the NF Stilly between 9/16 and 10/1?
Am I reading that right?
I have not seen the final report of the creel census but was told at the time the decision was made to close season early the fly fishers had caught 17 Chinook. All of the Chinook were caught in the Hazel to Fortson section of the river.

Curt
 
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