BBQ Salmon... foil or direct on the grill?

Salmo_g

Legend
Forum Supporter
Pot stirring...
An understatement, Thomas.

Considering the source, I'm not all that surprised at the results. Most of the people in the world who have been exposed to salmon, including the WA Post panelists, have mainly been exposed to real crap salmon. The other fish most such people have experience with is very mild white fleshed fish, and that is likely the best fish they have ever eaten. It kind of stands to reason that they will prefer salmon that is carefully processed and cooked in a way that closely matches the best fish they are already familiar with. That's what makes the mild tasting farmed Atlantic salmon so popular in the U.S. and Europe.

Since all 10 samples were "lightly salted," that gave the Costco farmed Atlantic salmon the obvious edge with its salt solution packaging. I'm alleging that because I'm not a heavy salt user on my food. But I salt my salmon fillets more than any other food I eat. Salt enhances sweetness. I think that the extra salt I put on my salmon extracts a sweeter flavor from the lipids in the salmon flesh. I've never done the chemistry work, but I'm pretty sure that's what's going on.

Other notes, I have no idea who Scott Drewno is, but if he's as good as the writer alleges, he should have called out the organizers of the experiment for their fish sample selection. And steaming salmon? I can see how consistency among preparations is critically significant, but for fvck's sake, what a travesty of fish cooking that is! Renown Seattle restaurateur Tom Douglas did a similar salmon tasting episode on his kitchen radio show. It was almost embarrassing to know that I could have brought a better product to his show. Taste is personal. And personal taste comes with experience. If a person's experience with salmon is mostly or entirely bad salmon, then I'm not surprised that they prefer the mild, tepid, flavor of lightly salted steamed farmed Atlantic salmon. They probably like Costco box wine equally as well as the good stuff costing $20 - $40 a bottle too.

6 out of the 10 samples were farmed Atlantic salmon. It's unfortunate that no wild Atlantic salmon were included among the samples. The king salmon from Willapa Bay are mostly Tule Chinook (altho some Columbia URB dip ins occur there), and Tules are quite possibly the worst excuse for Chinook salmon flesh in existence. And BTW, there are no commercially trolled salmon from Willapa Bay, so I'm guessing it's an ocean troll fish of unknown origin landed at Willapa Bay. The AK caught coho, both troll and Costco (gill netted) are pretty good fish, but have a strong salmon flavor that is lacking in the farmed Atlantic samples. Therefore the panelists, who clearly prefer fish with little flavor, placed those samples near the bottom. And another BTW, those AK coho are not even close to the lower Columbia River coho that Evan referenced. Species, stock, and harvest location all contribute huge differences to salmon quality and flavor. Even the abhorred Columbia River Tule Chinook is very good table fare when harvested in the ocean prior to sexual maturity.

And lastly, I guess I'm glad that so many people are unacquainted with really good salmon. The good stuff is scarce enough already. I would just as soon not have to compete with those louts for the good stuff.
 

brownheron

corvus ossifragus
^^^Yep, for me the analogue was 'factory wine' vs. single vineyard bottlings that express the terroir of where the grapes where grown and the traditional post-harvest processing. Many people actually prefer Yellowtail and such that are blended with chemical additives such that they taste exectly the same bottle to bottle and year to year. Give them a similarly priced bottle of 'grower' wine specific to a place/time/process that I would consider waaay better, they might be inclined to spit it out.

Humans have an ingrained consistency bias leading to familiar = good. I'm a bit of a rut-follower myself, so it's something I try to recognize and test for, especially as I get older.

This is an interesting thread across many fronts with a low signal-to-noise ratio. Appreciate the contributions from all the participants.
 

Evan B

Bobber Downey Jr.
Staff member
Admin
An understatement, Thomas.

Considering the source, I'm not all that surprised at the results. Most of the people in the world who have been exposed to salmon, including the WA Post panelists, have mainly been exposed to real crap salmon. The other fish most such people have experience with is very mild white fleshed fish, and that is likely the best fish they have ever eaten. It kind of stands to reason that they will prefer salmon that is carefully processed and cooked in a way that closely matches the best fish they are already familiar with. That's what makes the mild tasting farmed Atlantic salmon so popular in the U.S. and Europe.

Since all 10 samples were "lightly salted," that gave the Costco farmed Atlantic salmon the obvious edge with its salt solution packaging. I'm alleging that because I'm not a heavy salt user on my food. But I salt my salmon fillets more than any other food I eat. Salt enhances sweetness. I think that the extra salt I put on my salmon extracts a sweeter flavor from the lipids in the salmon flesh. I've never done the chemistry work, but I'm pretty sure that's what's going on.

Other notes, I have no idea who Scott Drewno is, but if he's as good as the writer alleges, he should have called out the organizers of the experiment for their fish sample selection. And steaming salmon? I can see how consistency among preparations is critically significant, but for fvck's sake, what a travesty of fish cooking that is! Renown Seattle restaurateur Tom Douglas did a similar salmon tasting episode on his kitchen radio show. It was almost embarrassing to know that I could have brought a better product to his show. Taste is personal. And personal taste comes with experience. If a person's experience with salmon is mostly or entirely bad salmon, then I'm not surprised that they prefer the mild, tepid, flavor of lightly salted steamed farmed Atlantic salmon. They probably like Costco box wine equally as well as the good stuff costing $20 - $40 a bottle too.

6 out of the 10 samples were farmed Atlantic salmon. It's unfortunate that no wild Atlantic salmon were included among the samples. The king salmon from Willapa Bay are mostly Tule Chinook (altho some Columbia URB dip ins occur there), and Tules are quite possibly the worst excuse for Chinook salmon flesh in existence. And BTW, there are no commercially trolled salmon from Willapa Bay, so I'm guessing it's an ocean troll fish of unknown origin landed at Willapa Bay. The AK caught coho, both troll and Costco (gill netted) are pretty good fish, but have a strong salmon flavor that is lacking in the farmed Atlantic samples. Therefore the panelists, who clearly prefer fish with little flavor, placed those samples near the bottom. And another BTW, those AK coho are not even close to the lower Columbia River coho that Evan referenced. Species, stock, and harvest location all contribute huge differences to salmon quality and flavor. Even the abhorred Columbia River Tule Chinook is very good table fare when harvested in the ocean prior to sexual maturity.

And lastly, I guess I'm glad that so many people are unacquainted with really good salmon. The good stuff is scarce enough already. I would just as soon not have to compete with those louts for the good stuff.
Yeah last year I harvested a very bright tule at buoy 10 knowing what I was getting. Wanted to just see what a "bright" one was like. Despite the meat lacking in any vibrance visually... it wasn't bad. Had a distinct flavor to it, but in a good way. Definitely a far cry from the "further along" tules that cut like oatmeal and wouldn't be fit for dog food.
 

charles sullivan

Life of the Party
Forum Supporter
I love king salmon. I grill it. I go skin down only. I use more spices than salt but the thicker fillets allow for more seasoning than sockeye (2nd favorite). King salmon has become difficult to purchase. The fish that can be bought is expensive. My personal life has become too busy to be a king salmon angler. Also, I amnot wealthy enough to buy a proper boat to fish for kings.
I now have resorted to bartering with friends and coworkers who get to fish the various bubble type fisheries for kings. I hope to pick dome up tonight.
As an east coast poor kid, I never had salmon really until I moved here. In fact, I had never grilled a fish at all. Grilled king is now my favorite food.
 

Stonedfish

Known Grizzler-hater of triploids, humpies & ND
Forum Supporter
What is everyone’s cooking time when it comes to thickness?
Mine as always been 10 minutes or less per 1” of thickness.
I once went to a bbq where the host put a foil wrapped, medium size sockeye on the bbq for over an hour. I think a maytag cardboard refrigerator box would have been more moist.
SF
 

Brute

Legend
Forum Supporter
Having lived in Hawaii over 40 years, we rarely ate salmon when fresh caught mahi, ono, ahi, various bottom snappers and reef fish were so readily available…now that I live in WA, it’s cod, halibut, rockfish and salmon. I prefer fresh king, having caught a few…but the prices at the market for “fresh caught” salmon & halibut are astronomical. I saw Copper River salmon at the store this morning for $49.95 A Pound…most families would not be able to put that on the table …
 

Brute

Legend
Forum Supporter
What is everyone’s cooking time when it comes to thickness?
Mine as always been 10 minutes or less per 1” of thickness.
I once went to a bbq where the host put a foil wrapped, medium size sockeye on the bbq for over an hour. I think a maytag cardboard refrigerator box would have been more moist.
SF
I go by an instant read
Thermometer at 130 degrees F…
 

Brute

Legend
Forum Supporter
Interestingly, there is a salmon dish that is served at every luau or on every Hawaiian plate called lomi salmon…lomi is the Hawaiian word for massage, since the ingredients are massaged together by hand. It consists of salted salmon that is soaked to reduce the salt, cubed into small pieces and added to chopped tomatoes, chopped onion and sliced green onion…it originated from the whaling days when Hawaiians crewed whaling ships and salted salmon they caught in the Bering sea as they chased humpbacks leaving the islands in spring…I use smoked sockeye to make lomi salmon here…
 

Pink Nighty

Life of the Party
What is everyone’s cooking time when it comes to thickness?
Mine as always been 10 minutes or less per 1” of thickness.
I once went to a bbq where the host put a foil wrapped, medium size sockeye on the bbq for over an hour. I think a maytag cardboard refrigerator box would have been more moist.
SF
Coming out of a 500° oven for a 1" thick filet I teach my cooks 115, 5° more for a thick filet and 5° less for a tail piece.

The slower you cook it the less you need to account for carryover to arrive at a perfect 125
 

Jerry Daschofsky

The fishing camp cook
Forum Legend
Salmon patties where a staple in our house growing up, I absolutely hated salmon patties 🤮 and I think I stopped eating salmon for about 10yrs due to that crap

Grilled or smoked is the only way I will eat it.
I still love them. Just on a plate with fried potatoes. In a bun with fresh made tarter. One of the foods I still love. Even eating them as much as I did growing up.
 

Salmo_g

Legend
Forum Supporter
What is everyone’s cooking time when it comes to thickness?
Mine as always been 10 minutes or less per 1” of thickness.
I once went to a bbq where the host put a foil wrapped, medium size sockeye on the bbq for over an hour. I think a maytag cardboard refrigerator box would have been more moist.
SF
It depends on how hot the fire is. With the charcoal fire I aim for, I cook a total of about 8 minutes for a 1" thick fillet.

You could probably cook a foil wrapped sockeye for one hour by placing it on a sidewalk in direct sun.
 

Salmo_g

Legend
Forum Supporter
I go by an instant read
Thermometer at 130 degrees F…
An instant thermometer sounds like a good idea. I've never tried that. But I think 130 might be a tad high since it will continue cooking a bit after removing it from the grill. Then again, I'm practically paranoid about over-cooking fish.
 

Mossback

Fear My Powerful Emojis 😆
Forum Supporter
An instant thermometer sounds like a good idea. I've never tried that. But I think 130 might be a tad high since it will continue cooking a bit after removing it from the grill. Then again, I'm practically paranoid about over-cooking fish.
122⁰...when it hits the plate for serving.
Thats is the perfect temp.
Other temps are not perfect.
:)
 

Wetswinger

Go Deep
Forum Supporter
Salmon filet, skin on. Take tweezers to pull out any bones. Oil flesh side. Sprinkle on liberally s&p, garlic powder, Ital. seasoning. Make sure grill is hot. This helps to keep it from sticking. Take a rag rolled tight and add oil so it's lightly wet. Scrub grill with rag quickly. Don't catch on fire! Put on salmon 3 minutes flesh down to get grill marks. Flip to skin side 4 or 5 minutes. Pull and put on a square of butter to melt all over it. Yumm...

Just like they taught me at Anthonys Homeport, when I worked the grill station way back in 93...Shilshole Bay..


20230608_172206.jpg
 

Matt B

RAMONES
Forum Supporter
What is everyone’s cooking time when it comes to thickness?
Mine as always been 10 minutes or less per 1” of thickness.
I once went to a bbq where the host put a foil wrapped, medium size sockeye on the bbq for over an hour. I think a maytag cardboard refrigerator box would have been more moist.
SF
Should’ve just taken that fish to a cookout instead of a bbq; if it’s a bbq, stuff is on the heat for a looong time so what did you expect?
 

Porter2

Life of the Party
Forum Supporter
I’ve done the foil, butter, onion, and lemon thing Jerry described above but more like 10-12 minutes cooking time.

I’ve done alder and cedar plank with a variety of seasonings. (Old Bay is a winner for me)

I’ve done the skin down straight which is nice because lots of times you can skin it with the spatula on the grill. Kids like that 😆

Almost all the time salmon is cooked in that 10-12 minute range and then transferred to a plate and foiled wrapped to rest for a few minutes with an additional slab of butter. (unless doing salmon burgers).

Now sometimes a thicker chunk of salmon I might give it a few extra minutes. But for most fillet cuts like you get at Costco your salmon is done in that 10-12 minutes range at 400°+. Don’t especially care for fresh dried out salmon.

* My wife stove tops’ cast iron meat side face down and heavily seasoned salmon and peels the skin off after 8ish minutes at the scene of stove top. I really like her cooking the salmon sometimes. It’s good.
She uses old bay and some other concoctions but always good for straight eating and especially salmon fillet type burgers.
 
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